Greg: You have totally lost the fundamental problem here …

Comment on LSU, Pacific Union Conference and North American Division Sued by Faith.

Greg: You have totally lost the fundamental problem here in your quest to be politically correct.

The church is not at fault here. These guys should be fired for what they were plotting, what they were doing, and what they were saying (as in the language used.) All these things breached their contracts with the church. The church is and should be within its rights to terminate such people. Far from being the dedicated teachers they claim to be, they were undermining church teachings for much of the long time they “served”. May God help see that justice is done.

Faith Also Commented

LSU, Pacific Union Conference and North American Division Sued

Faithful Disciple: Does it bother anyone else that the Department of Religion had been silent throughout this process? We are talking about our church’s Fundamental Beliefs here. Shouldn’t the religion faculty be up on the front line defending the church’s FB’s? If they aren’t, WHY NOT? They are paid to study, teach, and promote/educate our young people in the SDA religion. Is that happening? Is the Department of Religion an equal or worse problem to the Department of Biology?

It bothers me…especially since reading The Omega Rebellion. I have a sneaking suspicion that the teaching of evolution in the biology dept has a great deal to do with the teaching of spiritual formation in the religious dept. Once the door is open to error, it comes in like a flood. The religion depts in our universities are not upholding our SDA beliefs but are teaching our young ministers that the Bible can’t be taken literally, that the Creation story is just that…a story, and that we need to practice contemplative prayer–which is nothing less than old-fashioned transcendental meditation–a direct tool of the devil. Given that these ministers are going to be teaching the church at large very soon, we all need to be very aware of what is coming and be thoroughly grounded in the real SDA beliefs, or we will be deceived by our own sheperds.

LSU, Pacific Union Conference and North American Division Sued
LSU Alumnus 1996:

[edit] You might flatter yourself that you are an SDA, but you are not. Whether your name is on the books or not, when you are actually opposed to SDA theology, you are not really an SDA. And don’t plan on changing the church from the inside–God will not permit it. He will say, “Thus far, and no further.”

Which really makes one wonder exactly what LSU is teaching in its Religion dept. Obviously they are not doing their job properly if they are graduating people with your beliefs. Shame on them and shame on you.

LSU, Pacific Union Conference and North American Division Sued
Jim: “In what possible way would it glorify God, or advance His message that we’re supposed to be taking to the rest of the world, to unnecessarily drag the recording out for everyone to hear (let alone listen to again, for people like you who seemed to think it was their business in the first place to eavesdrop on a private conversation)?”

Well, Jim, I think the eavesdropping charge is a bit much considering this was already posted publicly–and by one of the parties involved.

I have heard the tape. I feel Holly is right to be concerned about what is on it, considering the parties involved were basically plotting to take LSU out from under the church. I think that is pretty serious business, considering that the church established this institution and considering the many, many years the church has supported LSU, not to mention the sacrifices that take place every day when parents put their children’s education before everything else.

Unlike you I don’t think this is due to “unholy and prurient interests.” As a lawyer you should know better than to accuse someone of that when you don’t know their motives.

Jim: “Holly, I’m pretty sure you know by now that La Sierra is being run by those who have already forced the resignation of those four individuals. In other words, IT’S ALREADY BEEN DEALT WITH, and presumably in a way in which you and others should approve.

Ok, Jim, you seem to think that this situation has been dealt with. I am afraid I don’t agree. It seems that some of the 4 still hold some sort of employment at LSU. Perhaps they have lost some of their positions, but not all. So, what is stopping them from continuing to spread their heresy in the church-owned institution?

You may not see this as a serious situation, but I do–and I believe Holly and others on this site take it very seriously.

As usual, the law seems to protect the criminal instead of the victims. My major concern here is the souls of the young people who trusted in their professors and were led straight out of the church because of it. If, as you say, you are interested in spreading the gospel, shouldn’t you also be concerned about which gospel is being spread?

Another thing–I don’t think you need to shout at Holly. She is trying to stay informed of the facts. I don’t see that as such an awful sin.

Recent Comments by Faith

Changing the Wording of Adventist Fundamental Belief #6 on Creation
And you are correct, Sean, PK must consider where his influence is going–for God or against Him.

Southern Adventist University opens Origins Exhibit
Mr Taylor,

After reading your comment above, I must say PK isn’t the only one in that boat.I would make some comment as to how I really feel about you, but I know Sean will only delete it and you won’t benefit from my insight anyway–seeing as Sean is more concerned about other people’s feelings than you seem to be.

How you have the nerve to come to this website and call us all a bunch of morons (which is really what you are doing) is beyond me. You and your cronies are the ones drowning in error. Anyone who dares to accept man’s opinions over the Bible or SOP isn’t to be trusted to define truth for anyone.

Too straight-forward in my comment? Trust me, I have restrained myself admirably. If you only knew….

Southern Adventist University opens Origins Exhibit
Further to my comment on skeptism and our professors, I’ve got to tell you that I found Prof Kent to be extremely annoying in his comments on EGW. He seems to think that she is an embarrassment to the church when she speaks on Science.

Personally I find people who dis her to be the embarrassment to the church. I really don’t see how they dare to contradict and mock God’s prophet. By doing this they undermine a lot of our church’s beliefs to outsiders as well as church members. God will hold them accountable for that.

Furthermore, David’s unpublished manuscript plus other books I have read on archaeology have reported skeletons of the type that EGW mentions. Also found were artifacts such as huge iron bedsteads made for and buried with kings of huge stature.

Just because you haven’t done your research, PK, don’t jump to the conclusion the evidence isn’t there. It’s there, all right, and you make yourself look a little foolish for not knowing about it.

Southern Adventist University opens Origins Exhibit
David Read said:

“Ellen White’s statements about larger antediluvian life forms are well attested with regard to many different types of flora and fauna. They’re not even controversial…

Hi David,

As you know, I took advantage of your kind offer and I read your manuscript as well as I purchased 3 of your books, one for me, one for my sisters, and one for the church library. It took me a week to finish the book, and I and my sisters are very impressed with it. My one sister calls it “one incredible book”. It has answered a lot of the questions we had on the subject of evolution vs creation science, and, yes, I believe we (you and I and my sisters) are on the same page in our beliefs. We have immensely enjoyed discussing the various aspects of the subject as we read. It makes perfect sense to us.

I still have a couple of questions–new ones will probably always keep popping up–but I would say you have covered the subject admirably. Thanks so much for this book.

I agree with Elder Wilson, this is something every Adventist should read. In my opinion it should be used as required reading for science courses. It is exactly the way I would want science courses in the universities to treat the Creation/evolution debate in the classroom. And if the professors at LSU and the other SDA institutions would do this we wouldn’t be constantly losing our young people and, for that matter, our professors, to skeptisism.

Thank God someone has the courage to publish the truth and expose error.

God Bless you, David.

Southern Adventist University opens Origins Exhibit
Hi Sean and Bill,

I am wondering if the difference of opinion here is due to varying definitions of the word ‘science’. As we all know there is true science and there is worldly psuedo-science.

If Bill’s understanding of ‘science’ in this case is actually worldly psuedo-science, then he is correct in not wanting any truth to be compromised with it.

From Sean’s post, I believe he is referring to true science, which is definitely part of our beliefs on origins and is well supported by the Bible and SOP, as Sean admirably demonstrated.

Not having seen the exhibit myself, I cannot comment on whether or not they are mixing psuedo-science into it. (Perhaps a few of you posters out there can see the exhibit and report back to us.) Knowing the general philosophy of SAU, I would be surprised if they did.

Their goal is “to provide scientific evidence that substantiates the Bible’s account of creation.” Sounds good to me.
They also say: “Religion and science don’t need to be at odds.” And that is true when you are referring to true science, which I believe they are.

However, I do understand Bill’s reaction in that these days when people use the word ‘science’ without qualification it so often means evolutionary pseudoscience, that we tend to be suspicious.

I think, Bill, that in this case we don’t need to worry. I believe SAU’s heart is in the right place and I am so glad that at least one of our institutions is willing to stand up and be counted on the side of Creation, even though they will probably draw much criticism from the ‘scientific’ community as well as from the TEs in their own church.

God bless them for their fidelity to Him. And may God strengthen them to meet the onslaught that is most likely to follow, is my prayer for them.