Eddie: If conservative SDAs can’t agree on the details of …

Comment on Supreme Court Decision on Church Employment Case by Faith.

Eddie: If conservative SDAs can’t agree on the details of something as vital as how a person obtains salvation, how can all members ever be expected to agree on the details of less important matters such as how and when the creation occurred?

Eddie, what makes you think creation is a less important matter? Creation is interwoven into our salvation. It was creation that caused Satan to go on the warpath in the first place. He felt he should have been consulted in the matter. And because he was not consulted, he is now trying to deny it ever happened in order to steal the glory from God. Evolution exists for this purpose. You should know that.

Faith Also Commented

Supreme Court Decision on Church Employment Case

Lydian: This Book is no ordinary Book. It is as sacred as God is–it’s Author is God Himself and it demands our deepest respect. We claim to believe what it SAYS–and we need to respect what it IS. At least this is the way I see it.

I agree with you Lydian. When I am typing and I make a mistake, I feel impelled to go back and correct it. Capitalizing does show respect. It is unfortunate that in this busy world we don’t take the time and/or effort to show this respect to God’s Word.

Supreme Court Decision on Church Employment Case
Ron: It seems to be when they abandon all hope of salvation even to the point of ceasing even to attempt to resist the temptation, it is at that point that Christ steps in.

This is utter nonsense. To cease to try to resist temptation is exactly what Satan wants, and will cost you your salvation. We cannot have enough strength to resist temptation on our own, but we must do our part.

Ron: It also makes you realize that neither God, nor the church are threatened by things like biology teachers teaching evolutionary biology.

How could you possibly believe such a thing? If, as you claim, you are all about the love of God, how could you stand by and see Him insulted? How can you see Satan robbing Him of the glory He so richly deserves? Is that your style of love?

He created us–each and every one of us. Genetics is the vehicle He uses to do so, but make no mistake, He is involved in the creation of each new life. He endows us with physical characteristics, grants us talents to use in His service, and then, with tender regard for this creation of His, teaches us, through the Bible, all about Himself and how the earth was made. Evolution spits in His face, steals from Him, and denies Him. Why should the church, who loves Him, accept and tolerate such abominible treatment?

Anyone who accepts evolution does not love God. You’re fooling yourself if you think such acceptance has anything to do with love for God or man. And one thing I do know–God does not accept such blatent rebellion against Him. If you think that tolerance of sin is love, you are absolutely deluded.

Ron: We see fear of losing the Sabbath, and blindness to all the other reasons to keep the Sabbath that would continue even if it weren’t a symbol of creation.

What we see is not fear, but the handwriting on the wall. Think, Ron, what would be the point of keeping the Sabbath if not for Creation, which it is a memorial of? It isn’t just a day off from work. Keeping the Sabbath means that we acknowledge God as our Creator. That point is so important, that it will divide the saved from the lost. If we don’t accept the Creation account as written in the Bible, we forfeit the right to eternal life with the One who created us. Why? Because we side with Satan in the Great Controversy if we deny God as our Creator. Did you understand what I just said? It is Satanic to believe in evolution.

So, yes, we have a right as SDAs to be upset by teachers/professors teaching this tripe to our children and young people. We have a duty to demand that this situation be corrected post haste, and we have an obligation to see that this heresy be put out of our church. Anyone who clings to this rather than the truth needs to find somewhere else to go and worship whatever apostate god they are esteeming higher than the real, genuine, God of the universe.

Ron: If it means that my faith in Christ and evolution are delusions and that I am lost, then I am lost. If Elder Wilson is successful in driving people like me from the church, then I will go in peace.

I find that incredible that you would trade your salvation for the theory of a mere man. How cheaply you sell it out.

I can only hope and pray that Elder Wilson will hold true to his mandate and will indeed be successful of purifying God’s church from the heresy that has crept in.

You say you feel sad for Bill, but I feel sad for you and all your companions in this delusion. How you cannot see where you are wrong is beyond me. But I guess that is what it means to be deluded, isn’t it? Plain and simple–if you accept evolution, you deny God. How can you not see it?

Supreme Court Decision on Church Employment Case

Ken: By the way you continue to ignore and evade my question as to whether you have taken any university courses on biology, especially evolutionary biology. Seems to the objective unbiased reader you have something to fear in evading that question.

The question may be asked, “Why do you keep badgering Bob Ryan as to whether or not he has taken any courses in biology?” I might point out that taking courses in biology has done irreparable harm to many involved in this whole issue. The professors who have been at the heart of this whole scandal certainly didn’t benefit from their study as it cost them their faith and belief in the Truth. Many of their students, receiving the heresy at the hands of their professors, have likewise lost their faith in Bible Truth.

Personally, I am a little tired of the worship of education. Education only has value if what is learned is truth. Much of what is taught in ‘higher education’ is error, and thus of no benefit to anyone. Much of this error is based on the suppositions and opinions of men who have taken this ‘higher education’ and have earned a few letters after their names. Once they have accomplished this, people seem to think them some kind of demi-gods and their opinions become ‘facts’ to those who have not had this education.

What Bob is saying is truth. He doesn’t need a certificate or diploma or letters after his name to state it.

Recent Comments by Faith

Changing the Wording of Adventist Fundamental Belief #6 on Creation
And you are correct, Sean, PK must consider where his influence is going–for God or against Him.

Southern Adventist University opens Origins Exhibit
Mr Taylor,

After reading your comment above, I must say PK isn’t the only one in that boat.I would make some comment as to how I really feel about you, but I know Sean will only delete it and you won’t benefit from my insight anyway–seeing as Sean is more concerned about other people’s feelings than you seem to be.

How you have the nerve to come to this website and call us all a bunch of morons (which is really what you are doing) is beyond me. You and your cronies are the ones drowning in error. Anyone who dares to accept man’s opinions over the Bible or SOP isn’t to be trusted to define truth for anyone.

Too straight-forward in my comment? Trust me, I have restrained myself admirably. If you only knew….

Southern Adventist University opens Origins Exhibit
Further to my comment on skeptism and our professors, I’ve got to tell you that I found Prof Kent to be extremely annoying in his comments on EGW. He seems to think that she is an embarrassment to the church when she speaks on Science.

Personally I find people who dis her to be the embarrassment to the church. I really don’t see how they dare to contradict and mock God’s prophet. By doing this they undermine a lot of our church’s beliefs to outsiders as well as church members. God will hold them accountable for that.

Furthermore, David’s unpublished manuscript plus other books I have read on archaeology have reported skeletons of the type that EGW mentions. Also found were artifacts such as huge iron bedsteads made for and buried with kings of huge stature.

Just because you haven’t done your research, PK, don’t jump to the conclusion the evidence isn’t there. It’s there, all right, and you make yourself look a little foolish for not knowing about it.

Southern Adventist University opens Origins Exhibit
David Read said:

“Ellen White’s statements about larger antediluvian life forms are well attested with regard to many different types of flora and fauna. They’re not even controversial…

Hi David,

As you know, I took advantage of your kind offer and I read your manuscript as well as I purchased 3 of your books, one for me, one for my sisters, and one for the church library. It took me a week to finish the book, and I and my sisters are very impressed with it. My one sister calls it “one incredible book”. It has answered a lot of the questions we had on the subject of evolution vs creation science, and, yes, I believe we (you and I and my sisters) are on the same page in our beliefs. We have immensely enjoyed discussing the various aspects of the subject as we read. It makes perfect sense to us.

I still have a couple of questions–new ones will probably always keep popping up–but I would say you have covered the subject admirably. Thanks so much for this book.

I agree with Elder Wilson, this is something every Adventist should read. In my opinion it should be used as required reading for science courses. It is exactly the way I would want science courses in the universities to treat the Creation/evolution debate in the classroom. And if the professors at LSU and the other SDA institutions would do this we wouldn’t be constantly losing our young people and, for that matter, our professors, to skeptisism.

Thank God someone has the courage to publish the truth and expose error.

God Bless you, David.

Southern Adventist University opens Origins Exhibit
Hi Sean and Bill,

I am wondering if the difference of opinion here is due to varying definitions of the word ‘science’. As we all know there is true science and there is worldly psuedo-science.

If Bill’s understanding of ‘science’ in this case is actually worldly psuedo-science, then he is correct in not wanting any truth to be compromised with it.

From Sean’s post, I believe he is referring to true science, which is definitely part of our beliefs on origins and is well supported by the Bible and SOP, as Sean admirably demonstrated.

Not having seen the exhibit myself, I cannot comment on whether or not they are mixing psuedo-science into it. (Perhaps a few of you posters out there can see the exhibit and report back to us.) Knowing the general philosophy of SAU, I would be surprised if they did.

Their goal is “to provide scientific evidence that substantiates the Bible’s account of creation.” Sounds good to me.
They also say: “Religion and science don’t need to be at odds.” And that is true when you are referring to true science, which I believe they are.

However, I do understand Bill’s reaction in that these days when people use the word ‘science’ without qualification it so often means evolutionary pseudoscience, that we tend to be suspicious.

I think, Bill, that in this case we don’t need to worry. I believe SAU’s heart is in the right place and I am so glad that at least one of our institutions is willing to stand up and be counted on the side of Creation, even though they will probably draw much criticism from the ‘scientific’ community as well as from the TEs in their own church.

God bless them for their fidelity to Him. And may God strengthen them to meet the onslaught that is most likely to follow, is my prayer for them.