Comment on Supreme Court Decision on Church Employment Case by Faith.
Ok, I see Bill is commenting on the law and obedience to it. I have been doing a bit of in-depth studying on this subject myself the past few days. Eddy has challenged me to support the statement I made concerning the necessity of keeping the commandments in order to enter heaven.
Eddie:
I, too, have been raised in the church, and I know that we are told that the law cannot save us. And, strictly speaking, that is correct. But does that mean we are not to keep the law?–no, of course not.
The law of God is an expression of His character. It is the law that heavenly society is based upon, and if we are to share in this society, we must learn to keep this law—just as we would expect to keep any law in any place in which we live. Can we do this on our own? No, we cannot. Sin has come into the earth and corrupted its inhabitants. At this point we need Christ’s grace to help us to keep the law—but keep it, we must, if we intend to be admitted to heaven. This is supported by statements from both the SOP and the Bible.
My daughter and I love the devotional book, This Day With God. We have read and reread it now for years and learn something new from it every year. I have spent the last couple of days mining out the statements from this book concerning the necessity of the keeping of the law for salvation and I will share them here with you.
“The Lord will not let His human treasure with Christ, its head, go into the enemy’s ranks without every effort made in their behalf. Their only hope is to do the commandments of God. “–p 28
“If the graces of Christ are not revealed in their lives, they (the professing followers of Christ) can never be admitted to the heavenly mansions He has gone to prepare for them that love Him and keep His commandments.”–p73
“Pardon is offered to all who will return their allegiance to the law of God. But there are those who refuse to accept a ‘thus saith the Lord’. They will not reverence and respect His law….he (Satan) holds in allegiance to himself all who refuse to keep God’s commandments, who reject a plain ‘thus saith the Lord’. They stand under the enemy’s banner, for there are but two parties in the world. All rank either under the banner of the obedient or under the banner of the disobedient.”—p 84
“Obedience to God’s commands will enroll our names in the Lamb’s book of life.”—p 87
“The way to heaven is narrow, hedged in by the divine law of Jehovah.”—p108
“Christ attaches a weight of importance to the obedience of His people to the commandments of God. They are to have an intelligent knowledge of them, and bring them into their daily lives….Not to keep the commandments of God is not to love Him.”—p 142
“Those who love Jesus will reveal that love by being obedient children. They will be doers of the Word and not hearers only. They will not be continually pleading ‘All that we have to do is to believe in Jesus.’”—p 299
“Heaven is only for those who have purified their souls through obedience to the truth.”—p315
“’If ye love me, keep my commandments’ (John 14:15)—not to select one or two or nine, but the whole ten—all His commandments must be kept…’He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.’ (1John 2:4) ‘For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.’ (1John 5:3)”—p319
Would you see the King in His beauty? Would you stand around the great white throne? Then you must obey God’s commandments because none will enter heaven who refuse to accept the law of Jehovah as the rule of life.”—p 320
“We can overcome only in the way Christ overcame—by wholehearted obedience to every commandment of God. True religion is obedience to all the commandments of God.”—p 322
“Obedience to the law of God is the question that is to test the whole world….”—p 325
Besides these very clear statements from the Spirit of Prophecy, the Bible says:
“Blessed are they that do His commandments that they may have right to the tree of life and may enter in through the gates into the city.” Rev. 22:14
“Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter. Fear God and keep His commandments, for this is the whole duty of man.”—Ecclesiastes 12:13
And, finally, here is a quotation from another devotional written by EGW:
The faith in Christ which saves the soul is not what it is represented to be by many. “Believe, believe,” is their cry; “only believe in Christ, and you will be saved. It is all you have to do.” While true faith trusts wholly in Christ for salvation, it will lead to perfect conformity to the law of God.
There are two errors against which the children of God—particularly those who have just come to trust in His grace—especially need to guard. The first . . . is that of looking to their own works, trusting to anything they can do, to bring themselves into harmony with God. He who is trying to become holy by his own works in keeping the law, is attempting an impossibility. . . . It is the grace of Christ alone, through faith, that can make us holy.
The opposite and no less dangerous error is that belief in Christ releases men from keeping the law of God; that since by faith alone we become partakers of the grace of Christ, our works have nothing to do with our redemption.
But notice here that obedience is not a mere outward compliance, but the service of love. The law of God is an expression of His very nature; it is an embodiment of the great principle of love, and hence is the foundation of His government in heaven and earth. . . . Instead of releasing man from obedience, it is faith, and faith only, that makes us partakers of the grace of Christ, which enables us to render obedience.
From Devotional: Our Father Cares, pp. 68, 69.
With the above quotations in mind, I don’t see how anyone can argue that keeping the commandments is required for entrance into heaven.
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Faith Also Commented
Supreme Court Decision on Church Employment Case
Lydian: This Book is no ordinary Book. It is as sacred as God is–it’s Author is God Himself and it demands our deepest respect. We claim to believe what it SAYS–and we need to respect what it IS. At least this is the way I see it.
Lydian
I agree with you Lydian. When I am typing and I make a mistake, I feel impelled to go back and correct it. Capitalizing does show respect. It is unfortunate that in this busy world we don’t take the time and/or effort to show this respect to God’s Word.
Supreme Court Decision on Church Employment Case
Ron: It seems to be when they abandon all hope of salvation even to the point of ceasing even to attempt to resist the temptation, it is at that point that Christ steps in.
This is utter nonsense. To cease to try to resist temptation is exactly what Satan wants, and will cost you your salvation. We cannot have enough strength to resist temptation on our own, but we must do our part.
Ron: It also makes you realize that neither God, nor the church are threatened by things like biology teachers teaching evolutionary biology.
How could you possibly believe such a thing? If, as you claim, you are all about the love of God, how could you stand by and see Him insulted? How can you see Satan robbing Him of the glory He so richly deserves? Is that your style of love?
He created us–each and every one of us. Genetics is the vehicle He uses to do so, but make no mistake, He is involved in the creation of each new life. He endows us with physical characteristics, grants us talents to use in His service, and then, with tender regard for this creation of His, teaches us, through the Bible, all about Himself and how the earth was made. Evolution spits in His face, steals from Him, and denies Him. Why should the church, who loves Him, accept and tolerate such abominible treatment?
Anyone who accepts evolution does not love God. You’re fooling yourself if you think such acceptance has anything to do with love for God or man. And one thing I do know–God does not accept such blatent rebellion against Him. If you think that tolerance of sin is love, you are absolutely deluded.
Ron: We see fear of losing the Sabbath, and blindness to all the other reasons to keep the Sabbath that would continue even if it weren’t a symbol of creation.
What we see is not fear, but the handwriting on the wall. Think, Ron, what would be the point of keeping the Sabbath if not for Creation, which it is a memorial of? It isn’t just a day off from work. Keeping the Sabbath means that we acknowledge God as our Creator. That point is so important, that it will divide the saved from the lost. If we don’t accept the Creation account as written in the Bible, we forfeit the right to eternal life with the One who created us. Why? Because we side with Satan in the Great Controversy if we deny God as our Creator. Did you understand what I just said? It is Satanic to believe in evolution.
So, yes, we have a right as SDAs to be upset by teachers/professors teaching this tripe to our children and young people. We have a duty to demand that this situation be corrected post haste, and we have an obligation to see that this heresy be put out of our church. Anyone who clings to this rather than the truth needs to find somewhere else to go and worship whatever apostate god they are esteeming higher than the real, genuine, God of the universe.
Ron: If it means that my faith in Christ and evolution are delusions and that I am lost, then I am lost. If Elder Wilson is successful in driving people like me from the church, then I will go in peace.
I find that incredible that you would trade your salvation for the theory of a mere man. How cheaply you sell it out.
I can only hope and pray that Elder Wilson will hold true to his mandate and will indeed be successful of purifying God’s church from the heresy that has crept in.
You say you feel sad for Bill, but I feel sad for you and all your companions in this delusion. How you cannot see where you are wrong is beyond me. But I guess that is what it means to be deluded, isn’t it? Plain and simple–if you accept evolution, you deny God. How can you not see it?
Supreme Court Decision on Church Employment Case
Eddie: If conservative SDAs can’t agree on the details of something as vital as how a person obtains salvation, how can all members ever be expected to agree on the details of less important matters such as how and when the creation occurred?
Eddie, what makes you think creation is a less important matter? Creation is interwoven into our salvation. It was creation that caused Satan to go on the warpath in the first place. He felt he should have been consulted in the matter. And because he was not consulted, he is now trying to deny it ever happened in order to steal the glory from God. Evolution exists for this purpose. You should know that.
Recent Comments by Faith
Changing the Wording of Adventist Fundamental Belief #6 on Creation
And you are correct, Sean, PK must consider where his influence is going–for God or against Him.
Southern Adventist University opens Origins Exhibit
Mr Taylor,
After reading your comment above, I must say PK isn’t the only one in that boat.I would make some comment as to how I really feel about you, but I know Sean will only delete it and you won’t benefit from my insight anyway–seeing as Sean is more concerned about other people’s feelings than you seem to be.
How you have the nerve to come to this website and call us all a bunch of morons (which is really what you are doing) is beyond me. You and your cronies are the ones drowning in error. Anyone who dares to accept man’s opinions over the Bible or SOP isn’t to be trusted to define truth for anyone.
Too straight-forward in my comment? Trust me, I have restrained myself admirably. If you only knew….
Southern Adventist University opens Origins Exhibit
Further to my comment on skeptism and our professors, I’ve got to tell you that I found Prof Kent to be extremely annoying in his comments on EGW. He seems to think that she is an embarrassment to the church when she speaks on Science.
Personally I find people who dis her to be the embarrassment to the church. I really don’t see how they dare to contradict and mock God’s prophet. By doing this they undermine a lot of our church’s beliefs to outsiders as well as church members. God will hold them accountable for that.
Furthermore, David’s unpublished manuscript plus other books I have read on archaeology have reported skeletons of the type that EGW mentions. Also found were artifacts such as huge iron bedsteads made for and buried with kings of huge stature.
Just because you haven’t done your research, PK, don’t jump to the conclusion the evidence isn’t there. It’s there, all right, and you make yourself look a little foolish for not knowing about it.
Southern Adventist University opens Origins Exhibit
David Read said:
“Ellen White’s statements about larger antediluvian life forms are well attested with regard to many different types of flora and fauna. They’re not even controversial…
Hi David,
As you know, I took advantage of your kind offer and I read your manuscript as well as I purchased 3 of your books, one for me, one for my sisters, and one for the church library. It took me a week to finish the book, and I and my sisters are very impressed with it. My one sister calls it “one incredible book”. It has answered a lot of the questions we had on the subject of evolution vs creation science, and, yes, I believe we (you and I and my sisters) are on the same page in our beliefs. We have immensely enjoyed discussing the various aspects of the subject as we read. It makes perfect sense to us.
I still have a couple of questions–new ones will probably always keep popping up–but I would say you have covered the subject admirably. Thanks so much for this book.
I agree with Elder Wilson, this is something every Adventist should read. In my opinion it should be used as required reading for science courses. It is exactly the way I would want science courses in the universities to treat the Creation/evolution debate in the classroom. And if the professors at LSU and the other SDA institutions would do this we wouldn’t be constantly losing our young people and, for that matter, our professors, to skeptisism.
Thank God someone has the courage to publish the truth and expose error.
God Bless you, David.
Southern Adventist University opens Origins Exhibit
Hi Sean and Bill,
I am wondering if the difference of opinion here is due to varying definitions of the word ‘science’. As we all know there is true science and there is worldly psuedo-science.
If Bill’s understanding of ‘science’ in this case is actually worldly psuedo-science, then he is correct in not wanting any truth to be compromised with it.
From Sean’s post, I believe he is referring to true science, which is definitely part of our beliefs on origins and is well supported by the Bible and SOP, as Sean admirably demonstrated.
Not having seen the exhibit myself, I cannot comment on whether or not they are mixing psuedo-science into it. (Perhaps a few of you posters out there can see the exhibit and report back to us.) Knowing the general philosophy of SAU, I would be surprised if they did.
Their goal is “to provide scientific evidence that substantiates the Bible’s account of creation.” Sounds good to me.
They also say: “Religion and science don’t need to be at odds.” And that is true when you are referring to true science, which I believe they are.
However, I do understand Bill’s reaction in that these days when people use the word ‘science’ without qualification it so often means evolutionary pseudoscience, that we tend to be suspicious.
I think, Bill, that in this case we don’t need to worry. I believe SAU’s heart is in the right place and I am so glad that at least one of our institutions is willing to stand up and be counted on the side of Creation, even though they will probably draw much criticism from the ‘scientific’ community as well as from the TEs in their own church.
God bless them for their fidelity to Him. And may God strengthen them to meet the onslaught that is most likely to follow, is my prayer for them.
