Comment on The Reptile King by EMK.
@Professor Kent: After doing as advised, you are correct . . .to a point. One comment, however, undoes all that was accomplished so swiftly in the previous paragraphs.
This is not merely an issue of methodology as I am understanding it.
I am all for students being taught to reason and dissect what they believe. They will come up against enough individuals that will challenge and plant seeds of doubt against God in their minds. They need to know how to study the Bible, work through a challenge and come to a complete and full understanding of the scripture and what it says.
And if that is the method being used to teach evolution by all means keep at it.
However, it is my understanding from several sources that it is questionable at best if this is truly what is occuring in these classrooms.
I am not trying to destroy anyone’s career, and I have never sensed that it is the purpose or the intent of those who began this site to do so. The call has been for Adventist teachers in this Adventist university to teach Adventist doctrine in their classes.
In 2000, CUC sued the State of Maryland to secure state and federal funds. The judge originally ruled against CUC stating that it was “pervasively religious” and this conflicted with the terms of the funding. During the appeal process, the same judge did some in depth investigation and determined that less than 100 of the non-religion department courses stated anywhere that the students would be looking at their subject matter through the “eyes” of scripture. (This was out of 540 puls courses.)
The outcome? CUC was deemed a public school by the court, thus eligible for the funding.
A public school? Shouldn’t we be “pervasively religious”?
Time is short. Rather than smiling and gently bearing with open rebellion and arrogant disobedience, we need to be working toward the restoration of souls. We don’t have time to harpoon one another because we’ve hurt each other’s feelings.
It’s time to set the emotions aside and begin the work of restoring our schools or closing them. We cannot much longer prey upon God’s grace, mercy and patience.
EMK Also Commented
The Reptile King
@Professor Kent: Thank you for being open, honest and transparent. I sign my name at the bottome of this list – except for maybe the statement regarding the Dodgers (I’m a Chi-town fan regardless of the sport) and Giem – as I don’t know who he is.
You are all in my prayers daily even though we’ve never met. I look forward to meeting you in our Maker and King’s presence some day.
Just please be cautious that in your defense of the Church authority and these good professors, you do not cross that line you are so careful to hold the rest of us to.
I dare say you shall not see me posting here again.
I appreciate your direct candor and honor the confidences that others have placed in you.
I will, as indicated previously, continual to pray for all involved – even those that I would hope you are laboring for in prayer as you chastise them publicly.
I am not, nor have I ever criticized LSU or the faculty.
I am asking for information that I don’t have the privelege of gaining by being an “insider” and that the “insiders” either won’t or can’t share so in turn do the very same thing that y’all are so quick to condemn Educatetruth of doing.
Neither of you have emperical evidence to claim that this is not happening.
The founders of this site claim that they started this discussion to correct a doctrinal problem in one of our universities. Last I checked no human can read their minds – you included. Therefore, the suggestion that this is done out of anger or malicious intent is completely irrelevant and unfounded.
You have not answered my question in any fashion but to tell me unless I can go directly to LSU and speak with someone there then I need to sit down and shut up. Yes, I realize that you haven’t used these words, but it was the gist of what you’re getting across.
I need to blissfully and blindly trust men to know what is best.
I have one thing to say to that:
I have determined to know nothing except Jesus Christ and Him crucified.
Seeing as how I cannot get answers that you claim you have, all I can do is work on the information that is being provided, use the brain that God gave me and pray for EVERYONE involved in this controversy. Because somewhere in the middle lies some semblence of truth.
God help us all.
Recent Comments by EMK
Ron: This quote demonstrates the cynicism and hypocrisy of the church over the issue of origins. How is the church going to have an honest and open discussion about whether the “6-day creation week really isn’t “fundamental” if you make it an a priory decision that anyone that argues the point must be removed from the church?
I think I missed something on the piece that was quoted. I read it to declare that anyone not employed by the church should have a right to express their views. HOWEVER, (am I starting to sound like a broken record) IF someone works for the church and we retain our “losely joined” understanding of a 6-day literal creation, there needs to be some consequence for teaching that which is antithetical to our churches doctrine.
Like it or not, the education system of the church is not the proper forum for those who would doubt God is who He says He is and did what He said He did.
And no one, that I’ve read here so far, is suggesting that we kick anyone out of the church because they’re struggling to allow God to be God.
Michigan Conference accused of shunning LSU choir students
I have to say that I’m impressed to see Michigan Conference holding firm to their original position. Why any member of LSU was not apprised of the request and why there was so narrow an understanding of the request is beyond me.
Michigan Conference – not Jay Gallimore – has taken the stand that this is not what they want for their young people. Whether or not you agree, the ugly comments posted against Gallimore are no more right than the personal and character attacks against the LSU leadership.
It was most appropriate for the academy principal to refuse the visit and should have been done initially. Like it or not, regardles of what you may think of the individuals personally, when they accept positions in our schools it is their responsibility to uphold the standards and expectations of the conference which supports them.
This is the one area that everyone seems to have forgotten. We are not a public school system. We are a school system that is run by a church that has specific doctrine and dogma. I have said it time and time again. These individuals sign a contract agreeing to uphold these doctrine and dogma and to instruct students in them. IF they are unwilling or unable to meet that contractual agreement, then they need to go work for someone other than the Seventh-day Adventist Church.
I understand having questions and concerns about the doctrine of the church. However, as an educator and principal, it is my responsibility to teach my students what the church believes not what my human mind has problems with.
Having been a member of the Michigan conference decades ago, I have never been prouder of the conference and Gallimore than in this situation.
Something runs through my memory about “Men who will stand for right though the heavens fall.”
LSU, Pacific Union Conference and North American Division Sued
This is ridiculous. LSU was well within their rights according to the contracts of these “fine gentlemen.” And to presume otherwise when they signed the contract to uphold the church standards and values of the church. There was so much of the taped situation that stands in stark contrast with their contracts and for it to make it’s way to the NAD – when LSU is already treading on thin ice with the church at large – is even more damaging.
In my opinion, this law suit is just one more evidence of our stubborn, strong-willed arrogance. God cannot possible endorse this endeavor. Nor will He wink at our arrogance much longer.
Prayer is the only thing that can truly settle this issue and work toward the salvation of all involved.
While I haven’t read the handbook, I have 15 years of educational experience in both public and private schools. It seems to me that if the policy allows for dismissal on the grounds of consumption, then removing an at-will administrator from their administrative duties is well within the rights of the president of the university.
Granted, (and we would all do well to remember this part of any situation) we only know what we are being told and speculation is a dangerous game.
At some point, we need to sit back and allow the administration to do their job. It’s a tough place to be and no matter what they’d have done someone would have been unhappy.
I think that the most damaging thing in the whole situation is that it was self-incriminating and then made public. I gasped through the entire article as I read it.
LSU has requested our prayers and we should honor that request.