@Richard Osborn: Dr. Bietz’s comments lasted 15-20 seconds. He gave …

Comment on ANN reports on affirmation of creation and FB #6 enhancement by Sean Pitman.

@Richard Osborn:

Dr. Bietz’s comments lasted 15-20 seconds. He gave no speech. He simply asked that the motion be divided since he supported the first part (which was a reaffirmation of Creation and a belief in a 7-day 24 hour literal Creation.) He in a few seconds said he couldn’t support the second part but gave absolutely no reasons for his opposition.

The reason why I am personally disappointed in Bietz’s proposal is because I know the history behind the effort not to make the wording of FB#6 more explicit regarding the “literal” nature of the 6-day week. Because of this there have been many, to include the administration and science professors of LSU who have interpreted the “days” of creation to really mean indefinite periods of time. It is only in this sense that they feels themselves able to claim that they are in line with all of the SDA fundamental beliefs in their teaching at LSU.

In fact, the last president of LSU, Lawrence Geraty, along with Fritz Guy, specifically worked to maintain what they considered to be the “vagueness” of the wording of FB#6 for this very reason, to allow for a much greater diversity of opinion regarding the interpretations of “days” than has been the historical norm within the SDA Church and contrary to the very clear statements of Mrs. White on this matter. I am sure that Dr. Bietz is also well aware of this history and the reason for the efforts to continue to maintain this “vagueness” in the language of FB#6.

Beyond this, however, my father was recently at SAU for a trust services conference. During this conference Dr. Bietz gave a presentation to his group in which he, in no uncertain terms, affirmed the position of LSU and argued in defense of their “academic freedom”. He, like Dr. Geraty, seems to have subscribed to the “big tent” view of Adventism where the Church is tolerate of teachers and preachers who believe in and even actively promote a long-age view of origins on this planet… enabling them to somehow attempt to be in line with both mainstream science as well as a semblance of Adventism.

Personally, I don’t think this is possible. Like Clifford Goldstein, I believe that mainstream evolutionary views are so fundamentally opposed to SDA and even general Christian thinking that such views would end up undermining everything the founders of the SDA Church and Christianity in general stood for and died for.

This is why I am disappointed with what Dr. Bietz did. Even if his speech only lasted 20 seconds, it spoke volumes to those who understand the current conflict and its history within the SDA Church…

Sean Pitman
www.DetectingDesign.com

Sean Pitman Also Commented

ANN reports on affirmation of creation and FB #6 enhancement
@Geanna Dane:

Evidently many Seventh-day Adventists- including most EducateTruthers- feel the Bible can’t be taken at face value and therefore more words must be added.

The Bible can be taken at face value given its entire context. Individual phrases, taken out of context, can be quite ambiguous and need context for clarification. Even though they are taken from the Bible, biblical passages do not stand alone. Their intended meaning is dependent upon other contributing passages and the overall context in which the passage was found.

Clearly then, taken in context, the obvious intent of the author of the first passages of Genesis was to convey the idea that the creation week was a literal week. This is quite clear to most Hebrew scholars, conservative and liberal. Even Lawrence Geraty supports this conclusion.

So, the effort to clarify the wording of SDA FB#6 by adding the word “literal” is by no means going beyond the obviously intended in-context-meaning of the biblical text itself.

Therefore, the resistance to adding this clarifying word to FB#6 by Geraty and others is based entirely on the effort to pacify those who would interpret Genesis in an allegorical manner, contrary to its clearly intended meaning, in order to try to somehow maintain the Genesis narrative while incorporating the evolutionary beliefs of mainstream scientists at the same time.

The SDA Church need not be open to this sort of pacifist effort – to pacify those with ambiguous language who hold beliefs that fundamentally oppose what we consider to be a vitally important Gospel message of hope as a Pillar of our SDA Faith; and even science.

Sean Pitman
www.DetectingDesign.com


ANN reports on affirmation of creation and FB #6 enhancement
@Richard Osborn:

As an academy principal at Takoma Academy, we also had strict rules on jewelry and dress and only taught what is being advocated on this web site. The results aren’t a lot better. Perhaps there are more important aspects of our church that we need to worry about.

There certainly are many other important things that our Church needs to worry about, but this does not mean that our Church should no longer worry about promoting and actively upholding its fundamental doctrines – doctrinal truths discovered and preserved at the cost of many fortunes and lives so that we might have the benefit of their understanding. The current secular society in which we live is naturally attractive to many young people. Interest in religion and God in general is waning in this country and in European countries as well.

In his book, “Already Gone” Ken Ham points out that young people see the church as simply a nice social club that really doesn’t stand for anything anymore – at least not anything worth sacrificing for much less dying for. Most denominations even question the literal reality of most of the Bible stories – presenting them more as allegories or moral fables.

For me and most other people, young and old, the idea that the Bible stories aren’t really true or reliable throws out a great deal of meaning that used to be present in Christianity. No one wants to be seen as ignorant or stupid. The opinions and conclusions of mainstream scientists have largely replaced the Bible as the only really reliable source of truth. Churches are therefore rapidly becoming hardly more than glorified social clubs without real conviction or a sense of purpose or of belonging to something important – a movement that is worth risking life and limb to support.

If you really want the Church to grow, really grow in a vital way, offer something that is worth dying for. Offer something that produces real meaning in life and a solid hope for the future. The promotion of higher critical ideas of the Bible and mainstream evolutionary concepts that strike at the very heart of biblical credibility will end up eroding real growth for any Christian church. Those Churches that are experiencing the most solid growth are those Churches that actually stand for something – where people actually believe what they say they believe and are willing to sacrificing everything for what they see as extremely valuable truths.

In the final analysis, interest in God and overcoming self cannot be forced and success should not be based on the numbers. After all, looking just at the numbers Noah wasn’t very successful at all. Therefore, what’s the point in watering down truth in order to increase numbers? Numbers are up to God and His Holy Spirit. Our job is to stand for those important truths that God has given us to improve and make our lives more hopeful and joyful – truths which many have sacrificed a great deal to deliver to us; even their very lives.

These Gospel truths, these precious foundational doctrines of our Church, should not be taken lightly. I myself was brought under the threat of court martial twice while in the Army for refusing to attend unnecessary classes on Sabbath. One time Admiral Barry Black, the highest ranking chaplain in the armed forces at the time, offered to come and defend me and the case was dropped when this was made known. I would not have been able to stand against such pressure if I didn’t believe in the reality of the literal nature of the Genesis account. But, because of my carefully studied confidence in the reality of my religion, it was a thrilling experience for me to be able to stand for God in such situations – a true honor.

This same sort of call and confidence in the Word is needed to keep our young people in the Church; to successfully compete with the innumerable attractions that the secular world has to offer to distract the mind from the most important issues and decisions of life.

Sean Pitman
www.DetectingDesign.com


ANN reports on affirmation of creation and FB #6 enhancement
@Richard Osborn:

http://www.wascsenior.org/findit/files/forms/Handbook_of_Accreditation_2008_with_hyperlinks.pdf .

In these documents you will find the Standards and Criteria for Review with guidelines that visiting teams and our Commission will use to evaluate whether a university which voluntarily applies for regional accreditation meets.

I looked in your document for how WASC expects “academic freedom” to co-exist with certain specific goals and ideals of the organization that owns the school, but am still a bit confused.

For example, several Catholic schools have let professors go who opposed Catholic doctrines in or even outside of class. A recent case of a math teacher in a Catholic school who questioned the existence of God on a public website comes to mind. She was fired for this ( Link ). Would this case be viewed by WASC as a violation of “academic freedom”? – especially given that she wasn’t even a religion professor at the school?

There is also the fairly recent case of the well known evangelical scholar, Bruce K. Waltke, who was forced to leave his position at the Reformed Theological Seminary (Orlando) because of his stand on evolution ( Link ). Is this a violation of “academic freedom” according to WASC?

I apologize, but it is pretty difficult for me to tell from the document you referenced. It seems like this is about as good a definition of “academic freedom” as I could find in your document:

Institutional policies and practices that affirm that those in the academy are free to share their convictions and responsible conclusions with their colleagues and students in their teaching and in their writing.

What is a “responsible conclusion”? Who defines this term and upon what basis? What rights and protection does the institution have against the attacks of a professor against the primary goals and/or ideals of the institution? Does WASC only protect the professor’s rights? – or does WASC also consider the ideals and goals of the institution as well?

Sean Pitman
www.DetectingDesign.com


Recent Comments by Sean Pitman

After the Flood
Thank you Ariel. Hope you are doing well these days. Miss seeing you down at Loma Linda. Hope you had a Great Thanksgiving!


The Flood
Thank you Colin. Just trying to save lives any way I can. Not everything that the government does or leaders do is “evil” BTW…


The Flood
Only someone who knows the future can make such decisions without being a monster…


Pacific Union College Encouraging Homosexual Marriage?
Where did I “gloss over it”?


Review of “The Naked Emperor” by Pastor Conrad Vine
I fail to see where you have convincingly supported your claim that the GC leadership contributed to the harm of anyone’s personal religious liberties? – given that the GC leadership does not and could not override personal religious liberties in this country, nor substantively change the outcome of those who lost their jobs over various vaccine mandates. That’s just not how it works here in this country. Religious liberties are personally derived. Again, they simply are not based on a corporate or church position, but rely solely upon individual convictions – regardless of what the church may or may not say or do.

Yet, you say, “Who cares if it is written into law”? You should care. Everyone should care. It’s a very important law in this country. The idea that the organized church could have changed vaccine mandates simply isn’t true – particularly given the nature of certain types of jobs dealing with the most vulnerable in society (such as health care workers for example).

Beyond this, the GC Leadership did, in fact, write in support of personal religious convictions on this topic – and there are GC lawyers who have and continue to write personal letters in support of personal religious convictions (even if these personal convictions are at odds with the position of the church on a given topic). Just because the GC leadership also supports the advances of modern medicine doesn’t mean that the GC leadership cannot support individual convictions at the same time. Both are possible. This is not an inconsistency.