@Steve Billiter: That’s quite a statement, just how are you …

Comment on Dr. Geraty clarifies his “Challenge” to literal 6-day creationism by Shane Hilde.

@Steve Billiter:

That’s quite a statement, just how are you going to prove that?

Remember what he said about FB #6? Let me quote it again below:

Fundamental Belief No. 6 uses Biblical language to which we can all agree; once you start interpreting it according to anyone’s preference you begin to cut out members who have a different interpretation. I wholeheartedly affirm Scripture, but NOT the extra-Biblical interpretation of the Michigan Conference.

He had a hand in the wording of FB #6, and it was his intention along with Fritz Guy to change the wording of the belief so that it was inclusive of other interpretations. How does that not undermine the church’s belief? How can you say FB #6 is so important and then be part of an effort that undermines it by legitimizing false doctrines? It would be like preaching the biblical support for Sabbath, but making the wording of the FB vague enough to allow Sunday holiness. You quoted him as saying, “I am glad to give those interpreters who wish to interpret it differently the freedom to do so. In other words, I support the evangelistic outreach of the church that is inclusive, rather than exclusive.”

Notice what he actually says about Genesis 1:

Second of all, I personally presume that Genesis 1 refers to an ordinary week, but since it does not say that explicitly…

He presumes Genesis 1 is referring to an ordinary week, not I believe that what Genesis says is true. There are many Christian leaders and theologians that admit Genesis 1 is intending to communicate a literal week. They just don’t believe that it really happened. Now since Geraty was so vague with you, it’s difficult to say what he believes.

Geraty says:

I am not challenging the literal 6-day creation week.

Of course he’s challenging it. He evidently doesn’t believe it’s the truth, otherwise he wouldn’t allow for false theories. You can’t say you’re not challenging something when you’re giving equal credence to views that undermine what you say you’re not challenging. Perhaps that was not his intention, but it’s what he is doing.

It is also slander to say that I “hired professors to teach at LSU that I specifically knew would undermine the Church’s ‘fundamental’ understanding on a literal creation week.” There is no evidence for that and it is contrary to all I did to make sure we had professors who were supportive of the SDA Church and creationism.

Geraty is claiming he didn’t know about the beliefs of the biology professors that were hired during his years there. I suppose if he was totally ignorant of their beliefs, then he could make such a claim. What about Larry McCloskey who came to La Sierra in 1996 as the department chair? This is what McCloskey had in his syllabus for BIOL 112:

It is vitally important for you to realize that this course—as a science course—is describing evidence from mainstream science, and is not dealing with beliefs. Some will decide they cannot “believe” the scientific evidence, and it is your right to decide. This is encouraged and supported. If you expect to be competitive in any modern science-based profession, and hope to perform well on standardized or pre-professional qualifying exams, you must simply know what the scientific evidence is, whether or not you ‘believe’ it.

Is Geraty claiming he didn’t know about this? Geraty retired in 2006 and was president at LSU for 14 years.

Steve, I think you’ve been snowed.

Shane Hilde Also Commented

Dr. Geraty clarifies his “Challenge” to literal 6-day creationism
This statement from the LSU biology department is nothing but misleading and bordering being an outright lie. It boggles my mind how they can claim not to promote the theory of evolution when it’s the only world view that is presented as truth. Absolutely no evidence has been found or presented by LSU that demonstrates that the church’s position is favorably promoted, if at all, in the biology courses taught. Yes, the theory of evolution is discussed, but many times as if it were true. This has been documented for over a year. When the professors believe the theory of evolution is truth and exclude promotion of the biblical world view as being true, then they are in fact promoting the theory of evolution. Unless they can show that they are promoting a recent, literal six-day creation, they are promoting the theory of evolution when they exclude other world views as being “lunatic” like one professor labeled those who believe in the biblical creation.

Keep in mind that many of the biology faculty personally believe in long ages of life on earth and common ancestry. This is not a secret. They also do not believe that Genesis 1 & 2 depicts literal events that occurred in the recent past. This is why we have never seen statements from the department saying we believe and support the church’s position in a recent, literal six-day creation. All they can say is that they believe God the Creator is the source of all life.

This is nothing more than a continuation of LSU’s deceptive advertising practices.


Dr. Geraty clarifies his “Challenge” to literal 6-day creationism
@David Kendall, PhD: Former LSU Student was there during the same time as you. In regard to dorm life, I don’t think that was he/she said was particularly unique to LSU. I dormed at WWU and LSU and both were pretty bad. I was on the 5th floor at LSU. I’m sure other floors were better. I don’t recall parties going on though.


Dr. Geraty clarifies his “Challenge” to literal 6-day creationism
@Brad: No, I actually I got them from Jason Lysle from Answers in Genesis. I’ll have to think about the first line of reasoning you proposed, but I think it’s missing a premise.

In the first argument you gave, it is assumed that space, time, and matter are dependent on the existence of God. If that premise is true, then the conclusion would logically follow.

However, in your example, you’re comparing two humans. Just because we each have a heart does not mean were dependent on each other. I think you were trying to show that and I agree.

You never explained how laws of laws of logic would exist in an evolutionary world view. We know why they exist in a Christian world view–God.

How does a big bang create immaterial, universal, unchanging laws? How about absolute morality? You can’t have absolute morality without God? Anything else is relative.

Laws of logic are immaterial, universal, invariant, abstract entities which govern all possible conceptual relationships. Laws of logic are contingent upon the biblical God. Not because they necessarily share the same qualities, but because if the attributes of the laws of logic existed independent of the existence of God then in one sense they would be God. But all this doesn’t explain how order comes from disorder, law from chaos, logic from irrationality.


Recent Comments by Shane Hilde

Elder Graham: “Why I Support La Sierra University”
@MLB: The article was written before Ted Wilson was elected. Despite personally knowing his views on creation from conversations with him, I’m disappointed that he’s taken this long to mention them. Perhaps he has published them else where and I am unaware.

I like what he says here:

As constituents of this union, you deserve accurate information.

That’s exactly one of the reasons Educate Truth exists, because LSU is being dishonest about their biology department.

And they are committed to making whatever adjustments might be necessary to provide the best Seventh-day Adventist Christian education possible.

Really? How can he say that when LSU has done absolutely nothing to address what is happening in the biology classroom? Even their attempt with the biology seminar class was a utter failure.

If his his two goals are all we are to expect then the board will have accomplished virtually nothing. There should be more than respect and support for the biblical creation account. It should be taught and promoted.

If anything happens at LSU to address the situation, it would not surprise me if it was because of out side intervention. The Board isn’t addressing anything.


La Sierra University Continues Deceptive Spin Tactics

Maybe the solution is for two streams of thought to be taught: conventional biology and creation science. Allow the existing professors to teach evolution and bring in creation scientists to teach the latter. That way there is no need to fire anybody or sanction LSU.

What do you think of that idea.?

Sean may give his own answer but I would like to jump and share what I think are some key points in regard to your suggestion.

We’re not dealing with preferences, flavors, likes, or dislikes. The SDA Church believes that what the Bible says is the truth. So when when LSU biology professors “only discuss” (new word from LSU) the theory of evolution as the truth, then we have a big problem. Teaching both world views is not the answer, because it is allowing plurality on a foundation issue. If you don’t stand for anything, you stand for nothing and that’s essentially was plurality boils down to.

The theory of evolution should be taught, but not as the truth. We don’t believe it’s the truth so why would we pay professors to teach it as such.

If the professors do not want to be supportive of the Church in this particular issue by promoting the biblical creation account, then there really isn’t any other alternative, but to fire them or ask them to resign.


Andrews University statement on creation
First of all, we’re not asking that the theory evolution not be taught. You have been misinformed on this point. The problem is how it is presented. They teach it as the truth. This is misrepresenting the church’s postion and contradictory to the Bible.

This statement from the LSU biology department is nothing but misleading and bordering being an outright lie. It boggles my mind how they can claim not to promote the theory of evolution when it’s the only world view that is presented as truth. Absolutely no evidence has been found or presented by LSU that demonstrates that the church’s position is favorably promoted, if at all, in the biology courses taught. Yes, the theory of evolution is discussed, but many times as if it were true. This has been documented for over a year. When the professors believe the theory of evolution is truth and exclude promotion of the biblical world view as being true, then they are in fact promoting the theory of evolution. Unless they can show that they are promoting a recent, literal six-day creation, they are promoting the theory of evolution when they exclude other world views as being “lunatic” like one professor labeled those who believe in the biblical creation.

Keep in mind that many of the biology faculty personally believe in long ages of life on earth and common ancestry. This is not a secret. They also do not believe that Genesis 1 & 2 depicts literal events that occurred in the recent past. This is why we have never seen statements from the department saying we believe and support the church’s position in a recent, literal six-day creation. All they can say is that they believe God the Creator is the source of all life.

This is nothing more than a continuation of LSU’s deceptive advertising practices.


Mrs. White: “Don’t send your children to…”
@Adventist in High School: You’re missing the point. The Seventh-day Adventist Church believes that God created the heaven and earth in six days, within the recent past (about 6,000 years). They believe Genesis gives an accurate depiction of this event. So the problem isn’t that our youth are merely being presented with a false theory, it’s that they’re being presented the theory as if it were truth. I would also add that the biblical/church position is not promoted at all, if it’s even mentioned at all.

These professors are taking our money and misrepresenting our faith to hundreds, thousands of students. When an employee finds that he can no longer uphold the beliefs of the institution and teach them properly, he should consider teaching for an institution that is more conducive with his belief system or be fired.


Michigan Conference takes substantial action in LSU conflict
@Marissa Channer: I don’t think you understand the Michigan Conference action. It doesn’t effect you at all unless your parents are employees of the Michigan Conference, but since your dad is employed at LSU, you have nothing to be concerned about.