Michigan Conference takes substantial action in LSU conflict
May 26, 2010 
197 Comments
The following is an excerpt from a document voted by the Michigan Conference Executive Committee May 25, 2010. The document was emailed to Educate Truth by two employees of the Michigan Conference (bold emphasis added):
Elder Gallimore
Whereas, the Adventist Review (in the article by Mark Kellner in April 15, 2010) has now publicly addressed the issue of evolution being taught at and supported by La Sierra University; and, whereas their board of trustees and constituency have collectively been unwilling to rectify this vital spiritual issue, the Michigan Conference Executive Committee has voted the following actions:
1. Effective June 1, 2010 the Michigan Conference has removed La Sierra University from its list of Adventist Colleges and Universities which qualify for employee subsidy. This means that no employee may expect tuition support if they have a dependent attending La Sierra.
2. With sorrow we feel it is our spiritual responsibility to notify Michigan Conference members that we do not believe that La Sierra can currently be trusted to be supportive of Seventh-day Adventist spiritual values especially in reference to faith in the biblical understanding of creation, and thus the authority of Scripture in the life and practice of the believer.
3. Resolved: To encourage each Seventh-day Adventist college and university to continue to strengthen the principles of biblical authority and faith. In support of these principles we urge continued development of educational strategies and faculties which would move these institutions to becoming centers of excellence in promoting, cultivating and defending creation science. We define creation science in the context of the recent creation week of seven ordinary, literal, historical, consecutive, contiguous twenty-four hour days of divine creation and rest as described in Genesis.
4. Furthermore: We request that the 2010 General Conference session vote a resolution affirming number 3 above, with the direction of bringing to the following GC session a statement that would serve to strengthen our fundamental belief number six. Hence, our Creation doctrine would clearly articulate our biblical view of “a literal, recent, six-day Creation,†in which “the seven days of the Creation account were literal 24-hour days forming a week identical in time to what we now experience as a week,†as the statement affirmed by the General Conference Executive Committee in October 2004 noted.
(Bold emphasis added)
Mcec Action Voted May 25, 2010
If you as a Michigan Conference of Seventh-day Adventist member wish to make a comment to the Michigan Conference about the above action, send an email with your comments to comments@misda.org.
See Evolution in Education? by Jay Gallimore
It is unfortunate that such actions seem to be necessary given the general lack of any substantive response from either LSU or the SECC over the past year since this controversy became more public. Michigan Conference bravely leads the way down a path that will no doubt upset and anger many, but in my mind is the only viable option for those who truly value the Pillars of the Seventh-day Adventist faith – as well as basic order, government and discipline within the Church.
May all other Conferences see the need to follow such a bold stand for the fundamental truths that God has revealed to us and which many have sacrificed a great deal, sometimes everything, to pass on to us. This issue is very important for the Church. It is indeed “a hill to die on”…
Sean Pitman
http://www.DetectingDesign.com
Sean Pitman(Quote)
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Praise God for the courage of the Michigan Conference leadership, in particular its president, Elder Jay Gallimore! This hardly comes as a surprise, considering the record of integrity and doctrinal clarity demonstrated by Elder Gallimore’s administration. If the North American Division is looking for a new president in Atlanta, I think we have our man.
God bless!
Pastor Kevin Paulson
Kevin Paulson(Quote)
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@Sean Pitman: I agree Sean. Unfortunately it seems like money will be the deciding factor in what LSU does to address their problem. I hope this action encourages other conferences to make their own stand on this issue.
Shane Hilde(Quote)
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Sean, I’ve been telling you nothing will be done by “please” “pretty please” and other such namby-pampy words without backed-up actions. It is time to start getting tough, and the Michigan Conference has agreed. Who will be next to stand up for God?
Ron Stone M.D.(Quote)
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Thank you MCEC. Your position is shared by millions; your bravery, sadly, by far fewer. But, God be praised, the tide is turning.
David Asscherick(Quote)
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PTL for the Michigan Conference. Finally folks willing to DO something. Our prayers are paying off.
mary hilde(Quote)
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Pastor Assherick, Their “bravery” is truly not shared by most out here in California. The general apathy of SDA members in much of the Pacific Union Conference is amazing. [edit]
Ron Stone M.D.(Quote)
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Praise God, something is happening!!! Educate truth doesn’t support my view that the school should be closed down.
LSU response will be ‘nothing’, business as normal. This action will mean nothing to them. In thier view we are the lost ones and we need to catch up to the ‘real world’ religions.
thomas(Quote)
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I have heard conversations about diverting a portion of the Lord’s tithe to the hands of faithful leaders and educators who stand for the truth of our caring Creator Christ Jesus. Some of the Lord’s money contained in tithes is now jeapordized to the evil work of deceiving young people in the name of a false Jesus. As others have indicated, if the prayers are not effectual due to the hardness of the hearts of LSU and our other leaders, the money will get results. Just think if the tithing aspect of all SDA members worldwide became a hardball issue in this game our leaders seem to want to play. At its root, sin is dishonesty and deception. God simply cannot bless it just because it is at some fancy university and protected by a big name church. Read the OT book of Judges. Read Jesus in Matthew 11:20-24. Come on LSU “leaders,” wake up! Resources abound at ICR.org, AnswersInGenesis.org, ScienceAgainstEvolution.org, Discovery Institute, and others.
Gary Warner(Quote)
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All of a sudden, I feel like I need to attend the GC Session!
Cheng(Quote)
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Thank God for the courage Jay Gallimore and the MI conference has demonstrated in taking this stand. Many of us have waited, waited, waited for somebody to do something. I have asked within the framework of previous responses, What is the bottom line for dealing with an SDA institution that apostatizes? and altho’ I’ve watched and waited, there has been no reponse or comment. This is the first glimmer of hope and brave action to deal with apostasy within our institutions.
It is a bold and decisive action. Michigan has developed a model for conference action by taking this initiative. I am presently in the Carolina Conference and I pray that my conference will have the courage and judgment to follow the same course.
Marilyn Bauer(Quote)
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So proud (in a Biblically correct way of course) to be from the Great Lakes State.
Richard Sherwin(Quote)
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@Gary – I am a laymember within the Pacific Union. I have been considering sending my tithe to one of the other conferences but was paralyzed by not knowing which one. Until the board of trustes does something truly substantial, I will immediately start sending my tithe to one of the other confernces. Michigan is at the top of my list. A sad day, and may the Lord help us all.
c torres(Quote)
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It was a sad day when the church had to deal with Kellogg and loose the medical center. But it had to be done. This is sad too. But it must be done.
Allen Roy(Quote)
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Praise God for leaders that are willing to stand up and be counted.
For those leaders not actively endorsing evolution at LSU – but choosing to remain silently neutral – I am reminded of a warning from God to this church -
While the Michigan Conference may be the first to come forward and take a stand – I am confident that they will not be the only conference to do so. We have others who will join in letting their voice be heard.
When Moses came down from Sinai and so apostasy in the camp He said “Who is on the Lord’s side – stand by me”.
I believe we have faithful leaders in other conferences who will hear that appeal and let it be known that evolution is not the doctrine on origins that is to be promoted by Bible-believing Christians.
in Christ,
Bob
BobRyan(Quote)
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The greatest want of the world is the want of men–men who will not be bought or sold, men who in their inmost souls are true and honest, men who do not fear to call sin by its right name, men whose conscience is as true to duty as the needle to the pole, men who will stand for the right though the heavens fall. {EGW – Ed 57.3}
I have been following this issue closely since David’s letter was first publicized and want to express my overwhelming gratitude for those who have stood for the right in the midst of this firestorm – David, Shane & Mary Hilde, Sean Pitman, Louie Bishop, the Review, many other supporters I don’t know, and now Elder Gallimore and our conference leaders here in Michigan. I’m encouraged to see that we have finally let our voice be heard! Thank you all for your courageous example! May the Lord continue to answer the prayers of the faithful.
Sheri Christie(Quote)
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“Criticism is something we can avoid by saying nothing, doing nothing, being nothing.” (Aristotle) Thank God this was not the MCEC choice.
Mel(Quote)
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This is truly a great day! I now for the first time have real hope that the GC session will take this up. It seems to me that they almost have to. I am now praying that the Central California Conference will be the next to stand up. That will take real courage, but it would send even greater shock waves into the bastiens of apathy.
It is very sad to have seen “peace and safety” take priority over fidelity for so long, and it is equally exciting to see someone willing to stand. Thanks Michigan!
George Hilton(Quote)
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George Clinton, I agree with you completely. If Jerry Page and the CCC will be next, it would be the only conference probably here in California that would. [edit]
Ron Stone M.D.(Quote)
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cTorres, My wife and I have been doing the same thing. The Pacific Union Conference doesn’t deserve a penny of any bible-believing SDA’s money until they clean up their act!
Ron Stone M.D.(Quote)
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Thank-you, Michigan Conference, for your courage and fidelity in this matter. Although my membership is no longer there, I still consider myself a Michigander in many ways. May God bless you!
Ethan Muse(Quote)
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A line has been drawn in the sand and God’s faithful will take a stand. Thank you, Michigan Conference of Seventh-day Adventists for leading out! There are many who will be displeased with your public stand, but you have pleased our Lord. You also have encouraged many who have been discouraged by the lack of a consecrated response by those in positions of leadership. God has a church and you demonstrate that boldly.
Again, thank you to all on the executive committee of the Michigan Conference! You are helping to prepare the way for the soon coming of Jesus and you are not responsible for any of our youth attending La Sierra who are being led away from Bible truth. God bless you all!
Richard Myers(Quote)
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This action fairly takes my breath away!
My son-in-law pastors in Michigan. We learned, even before he took up his pastoral duties, that the best annual campmeetings in North America are the Michigan meetings. This action is in keeping with the Conference’s habit of providing substantive guidance and meaningful protection to their flock. This action is courageous, and don’t miss it – recorded in the books of heaven. Thank you, Michigan leadership for this example of boldness and faith!
Robert Montague(Quote)
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I am thankful for the integrity shown by the Michigan Conference leaders. If we do not soon see a similar action by the Central California Conference I too will start sending my tithe to the Michigan conference.
Ted L. Stephens DDS(Quote)
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This comes as no surprise to me because the Michigan Conference is at the forefront of dealing with todays issues. While the conference below you sponsors (or did) an annual “Innovation Conference” with new age speakers — Michigan dealt with the Emerging Church heresy by inviting as their keynote campmeeting speaker last year someone who clearly exposed this form of spiritualism which is infiltrating “Christianity”.
Thank you Michigan for your leadership in all you are doing — especially on this LSU issue. Finally someone takes appropriate action. It’s very encouraging to see!
Virgil Stanphill(Quote)
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@Dr. Stone, thanks for sharing. I wondered before if other conferences would return the funds to me out of simple comity to their sister conferences. Your experience suggests such would not be the case.
Re CCC taking a similar stance. Take into account however, that it’s one thing for Michigan, a conference light years away in every sense from the scene of the action, to take such a stance. It would be a most valorous stand for CCC to vote a similar resolution. It really depends on the courage of the several men and women that make up its executive committee. Rather, I would guess CCC would be compelled to vote such in the event other conferences followed suit first. Either way, as David said above, a wave of support seems to be building on the side of right.
ctorres(Quote)
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My wife and I praise the Lord for this show of courage.
Michael Cookenmaster, Ed.D.(Quote)
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I hope more will follow, and will do so prayerfully.
Christiane Marshall(Quote)
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Actually this ws a point that also occurred to me today. Why not strongly support those conferences that do manage to stand up and be counted?
in Christ,
Bob
BobRyan(Quote)
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Drop Elder Gallimore a note thanking him for his leadership on this:
http://www.misda.org/article.php?id=124
Richard Sherwin(Quote)
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Praise our Holy God for the courage of the Michigan Conference Leaders — especially Elder Jay Gallimore. I second the idea of finding our man for the NAD President, if not the GC President, at the upcoming GC session in Atlanta.
Finally! Now, by God’s grace, will other conferences and leaders follow the leader here? The Lord is loving and patient, but enough finally is enough. And what a loving letter of explanation, yet written with forthright firmness and wisdom from the MCEC!
Larry Green(Quote)
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I wonder how AToday guys would spin this news?
Justin(Quote)
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@Justin: I’m sure Erv will think of something. I know the editor at the Spectrum blog was trying to bemoan the “underpaid families” in the Michigan Conference. That’s about all he could come up with for now.
Shane Hilde(Quote)
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Neither Spectrum nor A-today have an interest in advocating or sustaining bible Adventism. Neither should be allowed access to the GC sessions by having a booth to advertise their ministries as supporting ministries of Seventh-day Adventism.
Much more discipline should be forth coming in many areas of church administration. At least someone in authority was willing to condemn open and flagrant attacks on the bible. This is not just Adventism, but basic Christanity and fundamental Protestantism. This is so obvious we might wonder if it is simply a “red herring” to divert our attention from other important issues that may seem obscure to the minds of some.
While this error needs to be corrected, it is only the beginning of the necessary reform in many areas of the church today. Hopefully, a genuine revival of true godliness in every area of church doctrine and practice will soon follow.
The church will get smaller before it gets bigger.
Bill Sorensen
Bill Sorensen(Quote)
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While AToday reported that they were told they couldn’t have a booth if they didn’t promise not to promote books about financial scandals at that booth, I didn’t see where they were told they couldn’t have a booth if they promoted books advocating non-Adventist views on how long life on earth has been around.
Seemed contradictory to me. If the former are prohibited, the latter should be too. If the latter are permitted, why not permit the former too?
Bob Pickle(Quote)
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Leave it to the Michigan Conference to stand up for God’s truth. Mrs. White would be proud, I’m sure. Shame on you La Sierra University for allowing such evil to be taught to our children.
Pauline T.(Quote)
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“The church will get smaller before it gets bigger.”
There’s sure a lot of rejoicing going around.
Geanna Dane(Quote)
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There are going to be a lot of us praying that Jerry Page will have the strength, courage and support to bring the Central California Conference on board with the Michigan Conference on this absolutely vital issue. Thank you, Elder Gallimore and your Executive Committee, for showing true concern for our youth, our church and the third angel’s message.
Irv and Edie Logan(Quote)
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I would have to disagree with many of you. While taking a strong stand against something that they believe in, the Michigan Conference is risking the futures of any student of a Michigan Conference employee by refusing to honor their previous subsidy commitment. Perhaps they feel students will choose to transfer to another Adventist college or University, but having done this myself, I know that any previous class credits will NOT be accepted by every college and they will have to start over.
What’s more, threatening to pull tithe and sending it to another conference will only hurt those in the community it is meant to help. Does one school’s actions make it alright to refuse to continue God’s work in that area? I understand that you feel a stand is necessary, but at what cost? Are these actions in line with the Adventist doctrine you are so strongly trying to hold on to? I fear that this is only going to cause a division in the church, something which Paul did everything in his power to prevent.
I fear that the faith in the children of the church must be so low, that you cannot allow them to hear anything but what you want them to hear. What are you going to do when they leave school and are out in the real world, and hear opinions that differ from your own? God wishes us to think for ourselves, question, and formulate ideas. Without this we would not and could not learn. I also think that by doing this we can discover God for ourselves, and develop a true relationship with him, rather than one force fed to us by our parents and the church.
Elizabeth Wilson(Quote)
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A belief in Creation as given in Genesis is vital to Christianity and to Seventh-day Adventism. Praise God that there are men who see this and are willing to stand for truth. I had to write this letter to respond to the following statement in a previous post:
“The general apathy of SDA members in much of the Pacific Union Conference is amazing.”
I would not blame the SDA members of the churches. For too many years it has seemed that the conferences are not willing to listen to the concerns of the laity, and apathy must be expected, as activism is ignored or put down. I must say this with care, as there are bright and shining lights here and there that give us hope. And I also realize that you cannot please everybody — especially if you live in California !!
Hubert F. Sturges(Quote)
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We are rejoicing for such bold leadership which can only come from the Lord our Creator Who is in control of everything! Let us continue to wait on Him and not grow weary! God is just waiting for His people to wake up and stand for the truth and He will work mightily for them. “Be strong and of good courage, do not fear nor be afraid of them; for the LORD your God, He is the One who goes with you. He will not leave you nor forsake you.†Deuteronomy 31:6 NKJ We pray that the GC leadership will choose to please God and not man. Thank you Elder Gallimore for being a godly leader. May the Lord enlarge your borders.
Daniel Urrutia, M.D.(Quote)
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Amen to that!
Nathan(Quote)
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Praise the Lord for the decided action of God’s people in the Michigan Conference and for any who would follow suit. May many others cross that line to take a firm and decided stand for Jesus Christ who created all things in 6 literal days, resting on the 7th!! The words of the prophet Elijah ring out to ears of God’s church today, declaring, “How long do ye halt between two opinions?” “If the Lord be God, then follow Him: but if Baal, then follow him” (1 Kings 18:21). I surely hope too that the response of God’s people will be a lot more decided than that of the people in Elijah’s day…”and the people answered him not a word.” It wasn’t until God dropped flaming fire from heaven in the favor of His faithful prophet that the people were utterly compelled to wake from their complacency!
We must take this issue to the hill at the GC and pray for God’s anointing fire to prevail in the favor of His faithful servants.
The very purpose of our faith as expressed in the 3 angel’s message of Revelation 14 calls the entire world to worship the Creator. Any who do not have this message burning in their hearts are needing to BE called to repentance, they have no place in the action of calling.
Jesus says, “surely I come quickly.” Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus!” (Rev. 22:20)
Benjamin Burkhardt(Quote)
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The inspired words of our Lord Jesus in Mark 12:24 apply for only one of these two groups (Creationist or Evolutionist).. ” And Jesus answering said unto them, Do ye not therfore err, because ye not know the scriptures neither the power of God.” For our Lord Jesus the begining was with Adam and Eve(Mathew 19:4-8). They were created one flesh. “And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.” Gen 1:26.
We were created seperated from all species not coming for them and having dominion upon them. The fact that we speak and rationalize support the biblical revelation and not the evolution theory. Also Jesus spoke about the flood. Mathew 24:36-39. In this universal account is registered the destruction of animals and the human species. Gen 6:19-20 The Lord commanded Noah (It was an order) to bring into the ark male and female after their kind (species). These facts support the destruction in one moment of the dinosours. Something that the whole scientific world agrees with, that they died in one moment. Gen 6:12. This not only deals with the Adventist church but with the whole Christian church! And God never revealed to Ellen White or the pioneer founders that evolution theories were the key to find biblical truth. Evolution theories arose globaly in 1844 with the publication of Darwinian views and Ellen White never supported them or included them in her writings. Please read again Mark 12:24.
Franck J. Flores(Quote)
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Students have been waiting for the leaders of our church to stand. Praise God for the Michigan Conference’s courage! Truth is too precious to be compromised away by inaction. Our schools bear our Lord’s name. Please, students can only do so much without your support. There will definitely be casualties in this struggle; but leaders need to rise to the occasion nonetheless. Too many students are paying the price for cowardice amongst our church leadership; and for many, it’s too late. Let the students focus on their studies, and let the leaders start leading!*Sigh
Adrian(Quote)
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Thank you, thank you, thank you, Elder Jay Gallimore and the Michigan Conference Executive Committee for this bold decision. I could not hold my tears as I read your statement. There has been a deafening silence on the part of most of our leaders ever since this issue came to the limelight, and those of us who have agonized over this apostasy are grateful to you and the Michigan Conference leadership. I hope and pray other conference Presidents will have the courage to speak up on this issue and follow your example.
May the LORD richly bless your ministry.
Michael Adjei-Poku(Quote)
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It is truely a sad day when actions concerning apostacy must be taken from areas far from the source instead of being dealt with locally. Thank you my Michigan Conference for your voice on this issue. Though this issue may bring about some change through similar actions of other conferences, it will be “forced compliance” at best and those who have allowed such blatlant apostacy to breed will probably still be in administrative positions to direct the minds of our young people.
Mike Messer(Quote)
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As an LSU alumnus, thank you for this link. I wrote Elder Gallimore this morning thanking the Lord for the Michigan Conference’s courage. Now I will prayerfully consider today writing my own conference president, Elder Thurber, in the Rocky Mountain Conference, to urge RMC to take the same, bold, loving stand with firm resolve for the word of the Lord and the none to silent and ardent counsel of the Spirit of Prophecy on these matters.
Michael Cookenmaster, Ed.D.(Quote)
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I find it interesting that one of the most fervant progressive Adventist mouth peices, the late Madelynn Jones-Haldeman, of whom I was acquainted when a student at La Sierra, would make distinct reference to progressive Adventists being from a “Liberal, free mind,” and “Historic, EGW-believing Adventists” as being anti-intellectual slaves with authoritarian tendancies. As one of those Historic, apparently anti-intellectual Adventists, I believe that if I acquaint myself with the Truth, it will make me free indeed. My slavery is to my sins, not to my intellectual abilities. I believe that Adventist Today and Spectrum should have no place at the GC, not because I am for limiting free speech and thoughts, but because the Holy Spirit has directly led this church through the gift of the Spirit of Prophecy and Sister White. I cannot understand how you can be Seventh-day Adventist and disregard or minimialize the Spirit of Prophecy. It is the same as being a Christian and ignoring the cross.
Michael Cookenmaster, Ed.D.(Quote)
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AMEN!! NOW THAT IS WHAT I’M TALKING ABOUT!! PRAISE GOD JAY IS STANDING UP AND MAKING A MARK IN SDA HISTORY ,BUT MOST OF ALL,GLORYFYING OUR FATHER IN HEAVEN!!GO JAY!!!
BILLIE(Quote)
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Amen!!! May the Glory of God be vindicated in those that are faithful to His Name!! Praise be to the Lord!!!
Rand Craft(Quote)
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@Richard Sherwin:
Good advice!
Thanks for the link.
in Christ,
Bob
BobRyan(Quote)
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God bless Michigan Conference and Elder Gallimore for taking this courageous step.
May we all be as wise as serpents and as harmless as doves in these challenging times. The devil will take advantage of the slightest misstep or ill-advised word.
Brian
Brian(Quote)
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When I saw the comments last year from non Adventists on La Sierra’s adoption of evolution, I was aghast and then sorrowful. Now, reading the stance that the Michigan Conference Leadership has taken; I can only applaud Elder Gallimore’s leadership; to bring in evolution is to throw out the fourth commandment!!! I will persist in prayer.
Iye Ling Miller(Quote)
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Sanctions? Seems more like a move a government would make, not a church. When we reach the pearly gates I can’t imagine one of the questions will be, did you give LSU money? Something more along the lines of, did you overcome evil with good, love those who hurt you, overcome evil with good deeds? If your enemies hungry did you feed him, if he’s naked clothe him, if he’s sick care for him?
Michael(Quote)
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Re redirecting tithe – “Not by might, nor by power…”, and I might add, not by money – “but by My Spririt, saith the Lord of hosts.” For a thought-provoking/challenging/encouraging/humbling read on how to relate to God’s people in crisis, I have been immensely blessed with Ty Gibson’s “Trials and Triumphs of the Remnant Church.” I would highly recommend it. Souls may be lost not only from apostasy in the church, but from how it is handled by the guardians of truth.
B’Jay(Quote)
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The reason for the cited Resolution is valid. Unfortunately, nobody edited such an important document. Reading the split infinitives, plural pronouns in reference to singular antecedents, use of “Adventist” instead of Seventh-day Adventist, and so many wording errors was painful. Sevnth-day Adventist educational institutions should teach belief in Creation as described. Those institutions also should teach English grammar.
You are in my prayers.
In the joy of His service,
Pastor Teodoro
Pastor Teodoro(Quote)
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As a currently serving pastor within the Michigan Conference, I affirm the decisions put forth in this document. While it is never easy to stand up and call sin by its right name, stand we must. I am so very thankful that our conference leadership has not cowered in the face of this debate. Theistic Evolution is nothing more than Satan’s sophistry in trying to mingle truth with error; an age-old trick perpetrated since Eden.
In the midst of this mounting controversy let us all continue to pray for the decision makers at LSU. Surely, we want to see each one in the Kingdom, and I implore each one involved at the heart of this debate to display the same love and resolve as demonstrated by the MCEC.
Yours in Christ…
Pastor Darryl Bentley(Quote)
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5-27-10
I sent Michigan an email showing my support for what they have done. I only wish all of our other Unions would step up to the plate and do the same thing–including my own Southern Union.
After all, this is not just a “Union†matter. It is a world-wide Adventist church matter and strikes at the very core of everything we claim to believe and teach. I realize there are some who contribute to this discussion that feel we are too critical and judgmental but there were probably those in ancient Israel who felt Achan was misunderstood, misjudged and mistreated also–but apparently God didn’t think so.
There just comes a time when sin needs to be called by it’s right name and actions taken to rid the camp of the evils that will destroy it if they are not removed. That time, in this case, is long overdue!
Lydian Belknap(Quote)
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@Pastor Teodoro:
When complaining about English grammar, one really should edit such a complaint.
Lydia(Quote)
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This comment is irrelevant. Why?
1. Other world views are presented to our children daily and are encountered everywhere a student turns. Students do not have to “leave school and go out into the real world” to be exposed to lies. Lies are inherent in the human heart. Adventist schools should be a sanctuary where the truth is taught. Falsehood needs no more advocates.
2. The ability to formulate TRUE ideas and opinions comes from exposure to truth–the SIMPLE truth that is found is Gods word.
3. To pay for an Adventist education, or request subsidy from a conference to attend an Adventist school, necessarily requires exposure to an Adventist world view.
4. Our adversary was full of ideas and formulated many opinions. We know what happened to him (and in turn, to us). There is nothing new under the sun. We are dealing with the same issues today as our fathers did. Hopefully we will learn from their mistakes.
5. God says that the “Fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom” and “the wisdom of men is foolishness with God.” We cannot and will not understand truth if this is forgotten.
My prayer is that the people of God will be encouraged to adhere to the rock, the sure foundation that cannot be moved. That has been made easier to do by the example set by the leadership of Michigan Conference.
Thank you MCEC.
Kassandra McFarland(Quote)
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I am truly disappointed by the actions of Jay Gallimore and the comments of the so called Christians on this page. Your harsh judgement of one of our universities has once again shown that you are the hand that chokes your own neck. There are good Christian people that attend LSU, and by turning your back on them you have proven that our radical fundamentalism had done nothing but put a schism in our church. You dare to call it a sin? Shame on you! There is a good chance that many of you are secretly sinning in your lives, sins much more agregious than teaching both sides of the coin regarding the reason for our existence. (which, by the way, cannot be proven either way, and we all know it.) This shunning will not be forgotten; pray that God has mercy on your wretched judgemental souls.
Shawnindo(Quote)
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I am happy that someone is standing up for God on this issue, Sad that it has happened in our SDA University. May God continue to lead in this issue, You are in my prayers, Sincerely, Cindy Kiive
Cynthia L, Kiive(Quote)
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I am also praying that President Page and his staff will have the courage to respond to this crisis. He and the CCC are an “island of hope” out here in the Pacific Union Conference!
Ron Stone M.D.(Quote)
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Congratulations on making such a brave and Christ-honoring decision. The good news is a growing mountain of new evidences from every field of science contradicts the underlying hypotheses of vertical (macro) evolution and actually supports the biblical account of history. More significantly, the compromise of theistic evolution grossly distorts the character of our Creator from a Good Shepherd to a Great Predator who supposedly designed the horrible process of survival of the fittest, pain, fear, suffering dysfunction, disease, and death. Those who embrace the philosophy of macroevolution unwittingly remove the foundational cornerstone of the Gospel and the character of Christ our Creator.
Sid Galloway(Quote)
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I’m wondering too. [edit]
Ron Stone M.D.(Quote)
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@Shawnindo:
Although I definitely support the action of the MCEC, I do not support the suggestion of many in this forum that this is inherently a moral issue; that those who hold to evolutionary ideas are therefore “sinful” or “evil”. That’s not true at all.
That being said, however, those who think to take money from any employer while going about undermining the clearly stated goals and ideals of their employer are in effect robbing their employer of time and money – a moral problem in anyone’s book. No organization, to include the SDA Church, can long afford to pay people who are determined to undermine the organization itself. This sort of thing has got to stop or the Church will indeed fragment into irrelevance.
I also agree that there are a lot of good people at LSU, but these people, while being part of an organization that allows its professors to actively undermine the Church on the Church’s dime, should remove themselves from this organization.
Sean Pitman
http://www.DetectingDesign.com
Sean Pitman(Quote)
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Sean, You’re naivety is amazing. Teaching a worldly, humanistic philosophy in an SDA institution or SDA Church is not wrong? So, they’re just ignorant dupes of the evolution industry? This is not a moral issue? Ridiculous!
Ron Stone M.D.(Quote)
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@Shawnindo:
“Harsh judgementâ€, Shawnindo? Why is it “harsh judgement†to call sin by its right name?
Was God using harsh judgement when he drove Lucifer and his angels from heaven? Was He using harsh judgement when He drove Adam and Eve from the garden? Was He using harsh judgement when He sent the flood in Noah’s day? Was He using harsh judgement when He destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah with fire from heaven? Was He using harsh judgement when He allowed Jerusalem to be destroyed–including Solomon’s beautiful temple–and the Israelites to be taken to Babylon? Are you using harsh judgement when you discipline your children when they persistently disobey rules you have made to help them grow into responsible adults?
I personally know one young man who was heading down the wrong path and would listen to no one until he ended up spending a night in jail. One night. It was “harsh judgement†alright , but it absolutely transformed him and his parents never had another moments trouble with him. Today he is a very responsible husband, father and member of the community. There are times when a loving pat on the head or a light tap on the shoulders just isn’t enough and a good paddling (on the legs–not the padded bottom) if applied young enough and vigorously enough is an absolute necessity.
At this point a “light paddling†simply is not enough–LSU (and all who have allowed this open defiance to go on this long)need the equivalent of a “night in jail!†You–and some others–may consider this harsh and un-Christian but the rest of us consider it absolutely necessary and long overdue.
Lydian Belknap(Quote)
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@Ron Stone M.D.:
Perhaps I am amazingly naive in being one of those to start this whole conflict over a year ago. But, as naive as I may be, I think this issue is very important…
Also, I never said that believing in or teaching evolutionary theories as truth wasn’t “wrong”. It is wrong. It’s a mistaken theory and those who subscribe to it have been blinded to the actual truth of our origins – a view which has important implications to one’s personal outlook and overall confidence in the future, even one’s happiness, here and now.
However, there are different kinds of “wrongness”. It is possible to be sincerely wrong. Only God can read the hearts of humans and truly know if we are in open rebellion against what we know in our hearts to be true, or if we have been honestly deceived into believing in something that isn’t true. I prefer to let God be the judge of such things.
However, just because I cannot judge the heart does not mean that I am unable to judge the action. Long-standing actions against the Pillars of the Seventh-day Adventist Faith from within our own school cannot be tolerated decade after decade. This isn’t personal. I have many friends who are ardent evolutionists. Many of these are either agnostic or outright atheistic. Yet, we are still very good friends. However, they do not claim to be SDA nor do they expect a paycheck from the SDA Church for promoting their own religious or philosophical ideas…
That’s the difference. No one who takes a paycheck from me or from the Church or from any other employer for that matter is free to just go and do his/her own thing irrespective of the employer’s wishes. It doesn’t matter how honest or sincere you are or how close to God you are. It is always wrong to take money from anyone for doing one thing while you are actually doing just the opposite of what you’re being paid to do. This means, of course, that the employer must be very selective in who is and who is not hired to represent the employer.
This is such a self-evident truism that I am very surprised that anyone would argue against this concept. No employer can afford to pay just anyone as a representative…
This whole situation, in my mind, is simply a matter of Church government, order and discipline. It is not about making moral judgements regarding doctrinal issues… judgements that should be left entirely up to God.
Sean Pitman
http://www.DetectingDesign.com
Sean Pitman(Quote)
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It is certainly true that only God knows the heart. Even when we look at the issue of Jews persecuting Christians or the Catholic Church persecuting dissenters within the Catholic Church – one cannot claim that simply “being a Jew” in the days of Paul was equal to “not being saved”. Timothy is a good example of a Jew that was saved at the time of Paul.
And there is “wrong” as in Newtonian vs General Relativity not wanting to make room for Quantum Theory or the Quantum Theory guys not too happy with string theory etc. They cannot all be right if they are in opposition to each other and at times the difference have been marked by sharp opinionated rejection of the new idea on the block.
However in the case of Kellogg and the “Living Temple” is that simply a “mistaken idea” or was it morally wrong for Kellogg to do what he did?
Let us say for the sake of argument that we do not get into the details there – and instead we simply state that pantheism destroys Christianity.
Thus the individual case of the pantheist in question is left to speculation – or better yet – left to God.
The same is true with the doctrines of evolutionism vs Christianity. To expose evolutionism for what it is – we need not speculate on the moral condition of evolutionist-A vs evolutionist-B. (Though I “tend” to believe that agnostic and atheist evolutionists get more of a “pass” according to Luke 12:45-55 than do Christian ones.)
in Christ,
Bob
BobRyan(Quote)
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@Lydian Belknap:
Does that means that the Southern Eastern California Conference supports the LSU teachings?
Why are we only attacking the LSU she is under the Southern Eastern California Conference, so SECC is responsible and they need to be straighten by the GC.
God bless you all
Sailasa Nailava(Quote)
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In Europe and Canada – evolutionism is literally strangling Christianity to death. But in your post – you argue that Christians are being “Fed” by evolutionists.
Atheists have long admitted to evolutionism as the perfect elixir for what ails the evolutionist position prior to Darwin. So also have Christians admitted to the open contradiction between evolutionism and the Bible.
Your suggestion that we “pretend not to notice” the problem is not as convincing as you may have at first imagined.
hint: Condemning evolutionism in the LSU biology and religion departments is not the same thing as claiming that the entire faculty and staff at LSU are “not christians”.
A few gentle hints are in order -
1. Other Universities like Southern for example inform students about evolutionism while explaining the correct view on the doctrine of origins.
2. The words highlighted in bold in your text above are stellar examples of “judgmentalism”.
How paradoxical that you choose to condemn the very judgmentalism so prominent in your own post.
in Christ,
Bob
BobRyan(Quote)
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Mr. Gallimore has directly, blatantly, and undeniably undermined Fundamental Belief #14, while on the church’s dime. He must immediately resign or be fired.
Geanna Dane(Quote)
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Not only do the SECC and the SCC Conferences “support” the teaching of evolution as fact, they are the main reasons we have this problem (as well as many others) [within] our SDA Church. As I have stated before, the root problem is the adoption of and support of secular humanistic philosphies by these groups and others here in the Pacific Union Conference. [edit] Will the GC do anything? I have my doubts.
Ron Stone M.D.(Quote)
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If there are good Christian people attending LSU, it is a high-noon time for them either to demand the change in that place or to withdraw if that is not possible.
I would suggest to everyone here to write to his/her own conference leaders and plead them to act as Michigan Conference has done.
Justin(Quote)
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Justin, I agree with you entirely. However, those at LSU who are “good Christian people” seem to either be too afraid to speak up or so apathetic, they don’t speak up. [edit]
Ron Stone M.D.(Quote)
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@Geanna Dane:
One way to gauge the depth and significance of a man’s positions is to take note of the perspectives taken by the crowds that oppose him.
Very often the objective observer will find this little detail to lead to an insightful source of objective “recommendation” for or against the man’s views.
in Christ,
Bob
BobRyan(Quote)
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Why directing this to Elder Gallimore? The whole Michigan Conference Executive Committee has done this, and I am glad!
Anyway, this is a familiar ploy blaming those who stand up for what we agreed to believe. Who has shattered the unity of the church in the first place – except those who have been teaching & propagating the evolutionary theory to our young people in stealth all these years.
Justin(Quote)
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Does the Michigan Conference really find it necessary to be the bully in this issue? What purpose does it serve to punish everyone, even those who have no control in the matter? By taking away subsidy opportunities of those who even have a dependent attending La Sierra University, the Michigan Conference is showing that they lack “Christian” qualities of their own. This overarching condemnation of EVERYONE that attends the university and even those who may have family members attending the university is unwarranted. Perhaps the Michigan Conference should find not only a more effective but Christian way of reacting to this matter. When has simply cutting someone off ever helped anyone? I am a student of La Sierra University and I find this gesture disturbing and ridiculous. Also there is the fact that the teaching of Evolution on the La Sierra campus only affects a small percentage of students that attend the university. I have never taken a class that involves evolution, or creation for that matter, while attending school here. Why should I be punished for something that does not affect me or that I have no control over?
Andrea(Quote)
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FB14/28
If the Michigan Conference Executive Committee has violated Scripture to support a clear fall from the truth of God’s Word, it hasn’t been shown. They are upholding the unity of this church accordingly.
God bless,
Rich
Rich Constantinescu(Quote)
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@Andrea:
According to this logic, an SDA Conference would have to support any family with their tuition bills regardless of where they decided to send their children – even to non-SDA schools. That logic simply doesn’t follow. The SDA Church should be all about supporting its own – those who really do promote the Pillars of the SDA Faith.
And, just because you may not be directly affected by this controversy does not mean that it is not affecting and harming the faith of many students who are attending LSU. The SDA Church simply cannot afford to continue to support much less promote any institution that is actively undermining the fundamential goals and ideas of the Church as a body – even if the “problem” is limited to just one department of the school…
Sean Pitman
http://www.DetectingDesign.com
Sean Pitman(Quote)
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My heart aches to see this unnecessary “either-or” mentality among Christians. Believers split when they’re stuck on the notion that their only two choices are evolution and recent creation. Evolution often becomes the “default” position (and perhaps this was the case at LSU) when believers are faced with convincing evidence that the universe and Earth are truly ancient. But age, even billions of years of it, does NOT equate with evolution. Observed evolutionary processes cannot account for life’s origin and variety in ANY amount of time. Nor does an old age contradict a literal reading of the Scriptures. It is possible to embrace both a high view of Scripture (biblical inerrancy) and accept the facts (as opposed to interpretations) of science. This concordance has been affirmed for centuries in the Belgic Confession and was reiterated more recently by the International Council on Biblical Inerrancy.
Kathy(Quote)
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No. There is no honest way to accuse Mr. Gallimore of undermining Fundamental Belief #14
tom(Quote)
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I agree that the emphasis should be on biblical creation. But our students sometimes find themselves attending non-adventist graduate schools to read science. Is there anything wrong teaching them about EVOLUTION” but emphasize Biblical Creation and then ask teachers and students to take stand for Biblical Creation in their teachings and writings. Are we not going to teach about sin because sin is not one of our values?. By allowing our teachers to teach evolution and students to learn about evolution, they will be able to speak eloquently and convincingly the question is raised by non-adventists. The school will be wrong if it teaches that the world came through evolution but there is notthing wrong to create the awareness about Satan’s tricks. Lack of knowledge can lead to death. Also, if we decide not teach our people about Satan’s tricks, Satan will find a way of teaching them by emphasizing what it(Satan) believes.
COLLINS YEBOA SIAKWAN(Quote)
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I too, as a pastor in Michigan, affirm and support the decision of the MCEC.
Pastor Immanuel Roth(Quote)
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My brother or Sister, you are talking about SCHISM in the church but where have you been in the last 20 years?. The GC sessions in 1990 and 1995, voted not to ordain women as Pastors, but the Southeastern California Conference decided to do otherwise, and that decison did not bring SCHISM in the church, therefore this issue will not split the church of GOD either. Those of us who have passionately voiced our opposition to this apostasy at LSU do not claim to be ‘HOLIER THAN THOU’ and ‘SINLESS’. We are all sinners in need of the LORD’s saving grace. The issue of theistic evolution strikes at the core of everything that this remnant movement stands for. If GOD did not create this world in six literal days then why observe the Sabbath, and if GOD is not powerful enough to speak this world into existence like the Bible says, then how can he recreate sinful human beings upon his return, as pronounced by the Apostle Paul in 1 Corinthians 15: 51-53 “Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality”.
This problem at LSU has been going on for decades and the school’s administration has just refused to yield to the appeals of the world church. How long should we look the other way when precious young men and women are being led astray through this sophistry of the enemy. The eternal lives of these impressionable young students at LSU are too precious to be sacrificed on the altar of theistic evolution. We will not keep quiet just because people like you will brand us as being judgemental. The alarm bells have to be sounded to warn the flock, else the LORD will hold us accountable, for he has appointed each one of us as a watchman over ZION.
Michael(Quote)
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Kathy, my heart aches as well. Every time we allow Satan’s tricks, as Collins puts it, to infiltrate our lives, it creates burdens we were never meant to carry as well as division, heart ache and suffering. As Christians we should encourage as many as possible to live abundant lives and steer clear of the pitfalls, lies and deceptions, such as this.
In Rev 21:4, a passage that follows the complete destruction of the wicked, it says “And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes; there shall be no more death, nor sorrow, nor crying; and there shall be no more pain, for the former things have passed away.”
It is inspiring to me to see so many in our country who are standing up for God. It’s awesome!
Jon Hilde(Quote)
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Amen! Truth will conquer! I am deeply moved by this courageous action.
Sandra K. Reiber(Quote)
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Dear Dr. Stone,
I think you may have confused me with someone else. I don’t think I ever posted that statement on this (or any other) blog. I’ve kept copies of everything I have posted so as to be sure I don’t repeat myself too often! At 86 you have tendency to forget what you’ve done, you know.) I have no idea who did post it but I am reasonably sure it wasn’t me.
Lydian Belknap(Quote)
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FB #14 is entitled UNITY IN THE BODY OF CHRIST. When one conference penalizes ITS OWN membership because of a disagreement with another conference, exactly how does that support FB #14? How does that support unity in the body of Christ. The answer is clear as a whistle: IT DOES NOT. And YOU PEOPLE KNOW IT.
“He who is not with me is against me, and he who does not gather with me scatters.” (Matthew 12:30)
It’s laughable that the Michigan Conference has chosen to punish its very own people who have absolutely nothing to do with this controversy. How sweet and noble and thoughtful of them! With this decision are other conferences now likely to remove competing institutions from their subsidy policies?
Geanna Dane(Quote)
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Michael: Well stated. You’re analysis of the problem speaks to the root problem, which is secular humanism infiltrating our SDA Church, which has been going on for decades, while our leaders and most members have been “asleep at the wheel.” LSU, the SECC, and the Pacific Union Conference have all been a major part of this, as well as other problems, such as the acceptance of “gay marriage.”
Ron Stone M.D.(Quote)
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Here is an interesting post from Spectrum Magazine:
“Cheers for teams and this side or that side and rejoicing over “prayers paying off” is one of the most disconcerting, horrifying things I have ever witnessed. It brings to mind an image of a pit of burning souls with laughing, pointing people around the edges saying, “ha ha, we were right, you were wrong, don’t you wish you had listened when you had a chance? muahahahaha!” ”
Geanna Dane(Quote)
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And here is another one from Spectrum Magazine:
“The day before this action by Michigan, the Review had an interview with Elder Graham, president of the Pacific Union Conference and the LaSierra Board of Trustees, outlining the corrective actions that were being taken. So I’m wondering, did Gallimore write to him and ask how it was going? Gallimore didn’t copy him or the LaSierra president on his memo. I happen to agree more with Gallimore than with some others on the issue of the teaching of creation/evolution, but his action has troubling ecclesiological implications. If individual conferences start branding other conferences or their institutions as “apostate,” does that not equal schism? And shouldn’t Michigan have followed the council of Matthew 18, which in this case would have meant dialogue with the university and the Pacific Union Conference, then elevating it to the North American Division and the General Conference before acting in a preemptive manner.”
Geanna Dane(Quote)
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@Geanna Dane: Do you think they should continue supporting a Seventh-day Adventist institution that is blatantly undermining church doctrine? The Michigan Conference is responsible for how it spends its money.
LSU is the one causing the disunity. You sound like Ahab accusing Elijah of being a troubler, when in fact it was Ahab and his wife that was causing the trouble. I’m not meaning to equate you with Ahab or Jezebel. My point is that you’re ignoring the root of the problem and blaming those who are wanting to make a particular stand in opposition to those undermining our beliefs.
Bottom line is this: They don’t want to support what LSU is doing and they voted not to fund them. God does hold us accountable to how we spend our money. You seem quite willing to blame everyone but the troubler–LSU.
Shane Hilde(Quote)
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@Geanna Dane: I don’t think it was the day before. The AR article came out last Friday. The Board can say whatever it wants too. The reality is that they have produced zero results. The failed BIOL 111A class doesn’t even come close to fixing the real issue. How does one freshman class that only meets five times during the quarter supposed to counter the remaining three years of lower and upper division biology classes that promote the theory of evolution.
And get this Geanna. The class didn’t even counter what was being promoted in the biology classes, it supported it. So not only did it not promote the biblical view of creation, it presented ideas that were conducive to evolution.
So what are the corrective measures Geanna? It’s been a year now! What has actually occurred in the biology classes to address the issue? Nothing. All they did was start another class that supported what they were already doing. You’re welcome to believe the politicians, but their words don’t mean much when there is nothing to back them up.
Shane Hilde(Quote)
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To support evolution to any degree and in any form is in fact to demolish Christianity. “Destroy Adam and Eve and original sin and in the rubble you will find the sorry remains of the Son of God and take away the meaning of His death” quoted from ‘The American Atheist’ 1978 p19 as cited in the Christian News, Nov 11,1996.
Christians who give countenance to evolution in any manner do not understand the pernicious nature of that ‘doctrine’.
While a lot needs to be done in the SDA Church Educational system in that regard, the actions of the MCEC needs to be commended. Perhaps the men of authority within our beloved church will wake up and do what needs to be done at this time. Ps Gallimore and the MCEC should stand tall.
Osei Tutu(Quote)
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It’s good to see we still have some Seventh-Day Adventist in the leadership position, he’s welcome to come out to the northwest anytime.
Roger Brown(Quote)
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Well, well – It seems we’re really in those last of days. Who can be surprised, knowing the times we live in, plus having the Spirit of Prophecy already telling us that even whole conferences will be lost? Very glad for the stand in Michigan, and just continue to pray that the Lord will bring me, and all of us, through these very last days – and though I kind of dread it because of all the suffering and tumult that is to come that we cannot fathom (and it’s already so, so bad…) – I still kind of want to be able to stand through that, live what I’ve read about in the Great Controversy. But whatever happens, may we all ever be found in the Lord.
D. Znack(Quote)
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@Geanna Dane:
Thank you for sharing that spectrum quote – certainly it is fun to “imagine” that nobody spoke to the LSU Board of Directors or the LSU President about the idea that “evolutionism as the right answer for the doctrine on origins” — would be totally a wrong-headed agenda for an Adventist educational system. How sweet it would be to ignore all of the history on this thing until now – and just “imagine” that this is the first that the LSU board or the LSU president had heard that someone thought their innovative “all for evolutionism” direction in both their religion and biology departments – “was a bad idea”.
But as wonderful as such fictions are as a diversion – we all still have to check in to “reality” and are once again faced with the gravity of the situation that has gone on for more than a decade and the wreckage of student lives – faith destroyed by disguised evolution-minded professors, as the ‘monuments’ left to the adminstrative policy of “do nothing and hope for the best” when a crisis comes up.
in Christ,
Bob
BobRyan(Quote)
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@Geanna Dane:
How can two walk together unless they be agreed? – Amos 3:3
There is no unity between people or organizations if one party is undermining the fundamental goals and ideals of the other. LSU has been undermining the pillars of the SDA faith for decades now. They have been warned to correct this problem for as many years by many people. I myself have been involved with this effort for over 5 years now. It is because LSU did not respond to address this issue in any substantive manner that I decided to bring this issue public over a year ago. Still nothing has changed. LSU is obstinate in its defiance of the wishes of the Church body. At some point there can no longer be any “unity” with those who are deliberately obstinate against any effort or suggestion that would work toward unity.
Do not be bound together with unbelievers; for what partnership have righteousness and lawlessness, or what fellowship has light with darkness? – 2 Corinthians 6:14
My use of this text is not to suggest that LSU isn’t promoting any sort of belief in God. LSU does promote belief in some sort of God – just not the SDA view of God or His use of Creative Power. LSU also does not support the SDA view on the proper method(s) of biblical interpretation as a basis for key doctrinal positions. Therefore, it is the obligation of the SDA Church, as a body, to separate itself from those who deliberately and obstinately set out to destroy the very bedrock pillars of the Church as currently recognized as “present truth” by the Church as a body.
Sean Pitman
http://www.DetectingDesign.com
Sean Pitman(Quote)
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@D. Znack:
Mrs. White never says that whole conferences will be lost. This is a common reference, but it is mistakenly attributed to Mrs. White.
This doesn’t mean that it won’t happen. It just means that Mrs. White did not predict it. What she did say is a bit more hopeful:
Sean Pitman
http://www.DetectingDesign.com
Sean Pitman(Quote)
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Shane and Sean and others
With your reasoning the entire North American Division should lose all support from the GC for undermining the church’s official position on women’s ordination. How many of its conferences have employed women as pastors?
Geanna Dane(Quote)
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@Geanna Dane:
Some details that tend to eliminate that argument.
1. When Battle Creek was being condemned for it’s actions and its support of Kellogg’s “Living Temple” – it was not considered “violation of unity” to reprove wrong. And it never has been.
If Kellogg had tried a “he who does not gather with me – scatters” argument it would have failed then – just like that point fails now as a way to defend evolutionism at LSU.
2. This is not a case of one local conference at odds with another local conference. The university in question is not owned or managed by any local conference. It is owned by the Pacific Union – and even at that – not all officers of the Pacific Union are voting members of the board of directors for LSU. It is more precisely a complaint about LSU itself – and also about the administrators that are assigned the job of managing it – by extension.
in Christ,
Bob
BobRyan(Quote)
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This is the “you are not allowed to stop problem-A until you stop problem-B because I like problem-A” argument. It makes no sense because it only leads to those who like problem-B raising the counter equivalent agument saying “you cannot stop problem-B until you stop problem-A” argument.
The argument is only intended to paralyze the ability to take corrective action.
in Christ,
Bob
BobRyan(Quote)
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@Geanna Dane:
Women’s ordination, however important a concept it may be for many people (with whom I personally sympathize), is evidently not viewed by the SDA Church, as a body, as a fundamental doctrinal issue or pillar of the SDA faith. Note that there is no mention of it in the Church’s 28 “Fundamental Beliefs”.
http://www.adventist.org/beliefs/fundamental/index.html
It seems, rather, to be viewed by the GC as more of a cultural or social issue where the Church is trying to deal with very different cultures within the world-wide community of believers.
In other words, there seems to be wider latitude in agreement and action over non-doctrinal issues that are not foundational to the SDA faith…
Sean Pitman
http://www.DetectingDesign.com
Sean Pitman(Quote)
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In a most grand fashion, Sean Pitman dulty noted: “Do not be bound together with unbelievers; for what partnership have righteousness and lawlessness, or what fellowship has light with darkness? – 2 Corinthians 6:14″
That is why the Church’s hospitals must no longer accept Medicare and other government payouts. The universities must no longer accept federal student aid, federal or state grant money in any form, or even money from pharmaceutical and other private companies to conduct life-saving biomedical research. ADRA must dicontinue partnering with Red Cross and all other non-SDA relief agencies. Shane Hilde should resign his position as a schoolteacher at a public school. Sean Pitman must resign from his position so that he is no longer working in a Catholic hospital (for God’s sake). Bob Ryan should immediately discontinue his voluminous and frequent postings tot he Baptist Board. Not one of these organizations promotes the SDA view of God or His use of Creative Power.
(Of course one can defend essentially any position through selective quoteing of the Bible or E. G. White. If anything, the Bible passage applies more so to these other unholy affiliations than to the Adventist church’s relationship with its own colleges and universities.)
Rather than letting the church take care of its own business you people are placing yourselves above the church. You have shown extreme contempt and disrespect for church leadership. Rather than bash it and undermine it, you guys need to submit to the authority of the Church as God has established it- through its elected leadership. YOU ARE AS GUILTY AS ANYONE ELSE FOR UNDERMINING THE CHURCH’S AUTHORITY AND UNITY…AND YOU KNOW IT.
Geanna Dane(Quote)
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I think you misunderstand the situation @ LSU.
LSU biology professors have been teaching that evolution is the best & only viable explanation for the origin and existence of the world, and denying the creation account of Genesis 1 & 2. They have been very insistent about this and was propagating their “belief” to our children in that school. And the school administrators are protecting them. This is the root of the problem.
Nobody here has any issue with our schools introducing the evolutionary theory to our students as a “theory” and also providing them with the biblical worldview of the special creation that convincingly counter this absurd kooky theory of evolution.
Justin(Quote)
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@Geanna
“Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?” 2 Corinthians 6:14
“Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby.” Hebrews 12:11
MCEC is against LSU and not the Pacific Union conference or even the Pacific Union. LSU isn’t owned by the PUC. If there was an unchecked initiative at Andrews University within Michigan to teach reincarnation the same resolution would follow, I am positive, against that school and much sooner than it has taken to deal with this problem.
It all depends on who is holding the whistle. Didn’t you know the lymphatic system is a part of the body which defends against unhealthful elements and thus promotes unity by facilitating some “combat?” We are still living on sinful planet earth and there are dangers to be met from both devils and man. (Eph. 6:11, 12; Matthew 7:15)
I notice you neglect to post the belief and prove your point. That is because a simple reading of it shatters all your pretensions. We will see it promotes unity in the Scriptures and not wild imaginative philosophy and an “all paths lead to the mountaintop” false-unity.
Jesus warned us this departure from truth would happen by the first angel’s message (Rev. 14:7) and the testimony of Jesus. His sheep will hear this message.
“If the foot shall say, Because I am not the hand, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body?” 1 Cor. 12:15
SDA conferences do not own SDA universities. Most SDA universities are owned by SDA unions. However, Andrews University in Michigan is SDA General Conference run, not even Lake Union run, so this suggestion is without merit.
God bless,
Rich
Rich Constantinescu(Quote)
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Some years ago, I read a short exposition on unity & division written by A.W. Tozer, which helped me to see through the false premise of the so-called “unity” argument. I’d recommend it to all:
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DIVISIONS ARE NOT ALWAYS BAD
When to unite and when to divide, that is the question, and a right answer requires the wisdom of a Solomon.
Some settle the problem by rule of thumb: All union is good and all division bad. It’s that easy. But obviously this effortless way of dealing with the matter ignores the lessons of history and overlooks some of the deep spiritual laws by which men live.
If good men were all for union and bad men for division, or vice versa, that would simplify things for us. Or if it could be shown that God always unites and the devil always divides it would be easy to find our way around in this confused and confusing world. But that is not how things are.
To divide what should be divided and unite what should be united is the part of wisdom. Unions of dissimilar elements is never good even where it is possible, nor is the arbitrary division of elements that are alike; and this is as certainly true of things moral and religious as of things political or scientific.
The first divider was God who at the creation divided the light from the darkness. This division set the direction for all God’s dealings in nature and in grace. Light and darkness are incompatible; to try to have both in the same place at once is to try the impossible and end by havng neither the one nor the other, but dimness rather, and obscurity.
In the world of men there are at present scarcely any sharp outlines. The race is fallen. Sin has brought confusion. The wheat grows with the tares, the sheep and the goats coexist, the farms of the just and the unjust lie side by side in the landscape, the mission is next door to the saloon.
But things will not always be so. The hour is coming when the sheep with be divided from the goats and the tares separated from the wheat. God will again divide the light from the darkness and all things will run to their kind. Tares will go into the fire with tares and wheat into the garner with wheat. The dimness will lift like a fog and all outlines will appear. Hell will be seen to be hell all the way through, and heaven revealed as the one home of all who bear the nature of the one God.
For that time we with patience wait. In the meanwhile for each of us, and for the church wherever she appears in human society, the constantly recurring question must be: What shall we unite with and from what shall we separate? The question of coexistence does not enter here, but the question of union and fellowship does. The wheat grows in the same field with the tares, but shall the two cross-polinate? The sheep graze near the goats, but shall they seek to interbreed? The unjust and the just enjoy the same rain and sunshine, but shall they forget their deep moral differences and intermarry?
To these questions the popular answer is yes. Union for union’s sake, and men shall be brothers be for a’ that. Unity is so devoutly to be desired that no price is too high to pay for it and nothing is important enough to keep us apart. Truth is slain to provide a feast to celebrate the marriage of heaven and hell, and all to support a concept of unity which has no basis in the Word of God.
The Spirit-illuminated church will have none of this. In a fallen world like ours unity is no treasure to be purchased at the price of compromise. Loyalty to God, faithfulness and truth and the preservation of a good conscience are jewels more precious than gold of Ophir or diamonds from the mine. For these jewels men have suffered the loss of property, imprisonment and even death; for them, even in recent times, behind the various curtains, followers of Christ have paid the last full measure of devotion and quietly died, unknown to and unsung by the great world, but known to God and dear to His Father heart.
In the day that shall declare the secrets of all souls these shall come forth to receive the deeds done in the body. Surely such as these are wiser philosophers than the religious camp followers of meaningless unity who have not the courage to stand against the vogues and who bleat for brotherhood only because it happens to be for the time popular.
“Divide and conquer” is the cynical slogan of Machiavellian political leaders, but Satan knows how to unite and conquer. To bring a nation to its knees the aspiring dictator must unite it. By repeated appeals to national pride or to the need to avenge some past or present wrong the demagogue succeeds in uniting the populace behind him. It is easy after that to take control of the military and to beat the legislature into submission. Then follows almost perfect unity indeed, but it is the unity of the stockyards and the concentration camp. We have seen this happen several times in this century, and the world will see it at least once more when the nations of the earth are united under Antichrist.
When confused sheep start over a cliff the individual sheep can save himself only be separating from the flock. Perfect unity at such a time can only mean total destruction for all. The wise sheep to save his own hide disaffiliates.
Power lies in the union of things similar and the division of things dissimilar. Maybe what we need in religious circles today is not more union but some wise and courageous division. Everyone desires peace but it could be that revival will follow the sword.
Justin(Quote)
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As the issues have been clearly presented and understood, it is noteworthy that decided action is being taken – and we thank God for that.
Thank you too, Michigan Conference of Seventh-day Adventists.
The issue here is that our very identity and mission are being attacked and undermined. Seventh-day Adventists are the ones who are entrusted with the final message to be given to our world, “Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters” (Revelation 14:7).
Decidedly, knowing Who God is carries an importance of eternal impact. Jesus stated this in John 17:3.
Our young people must definitely be protected from any subversively rebellious attitude towards God, His Word, and His Church. And they must positively be guarded from teachings that contradict the Bible.
I hope Administration at La Sierra awakens to their responsibility before it is too late.
Thank you, Educate Truth for having the courage to make the issues known. Thank you, Review and Herald for reporting on this also. Thank you, again, Michigan Conference for not looking the other way but for taking concrete steps to deal with this. And I thank God that He’s still in control and that He is coming soon.
Olga Sanchez
Olga Sanchez(Quote)
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Thank you Rich and others for making your position explicitly clear. You have eloquently argued for division and fractionation within the church at the expense of unity. And you have artfully used the Bible, Ellen White, and your interpretation of FB #14 as supportive of dividing the church. Well done!
Or…oh no…do I hear double-speak acoming?
Geanna Dane(Quote)
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Funny that the one charge no one has answered to is the DELIBERATE tactic used here to PUBLICLY HUMILIATE, SHAME AND DENIGRATE institutions and individuals, who are named over and over, in an effort to blatantly subvert and undermine the divinely appointed (elected) church leadership. This website is nothing less than this; a propaganda campaign intended to SMEAR and CAUSE HARM to others. Is this not your intent? Hello?!
Again, YOU PEOPLE ARE BLATANTLY AND ENTHUSIASTICALLY UNDERMINING THE CHURCH’S AUTHORITY AND UNITY.
Shane, you asked what alternatives there are. Obviously you went ahead with your own solution without waiting for the elected church leadership to solve the problem. In doing so you and your cohorts here have declared yourselves the de facto church leadership. We now bow down to you (and anyone else in the future who eagerly employs public deridement of others).
Enjoy your victory with smugness and righteousness. I quit. No more from me.
Geanna Dane(Quote)
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I am amazed continually how the Spirit of Prophecy consistently redirects us to the love of God, His faithfulness, His steadfastness, and our need to study His word. Here is another tid-bit from Sister White’s book, Maranatha, p. 157…food for thought this morning as you read through all the blog comments on this topic.
“Satan is a cunning worker, and he will bring in subtle fallacies to darken and confuse the mind and root out the doctrines of salvation. THOSE WHO DO NOT ACCEPT THE WORD OF GOD JUST AS IT READ, WILL BE SNARED BY HIS TRAP.
Evil angels are upon our track every moment. By departing from the plain precepts and commandments of God, and giving heed to fables, the minds of many are preparing to receive these lying wonders [of Satan] . We must all now seek to arm ourselves for the contest in which we [now] engage. Faith in God’s word, prayerfully studied and practically applied, will be our shield from Satan’s power and will bring us off conquerors through the blood of Christ.
Michael Cookenmaster, Ed.D.(Quote)
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@Geanna Dane:
How consistent the tactic of using “projection” by those that happen to be promoting error.
Think about this for a minute – isn’t that statement above exactly the problem with the LSU biology and religion department adopting their own rogue all-for-evolutionism agenda no matter what the decision of the Adventist denomination?
I am also amazed at how often that tactic is used because it places the heart of the problem “in plain sight”.
in Christ,
Bob
BobRyan(Quote)
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I support the action taken by the Michigan Conference.
However, I am puzzled at the significant mistakes made in the titles of those copied at the end: Elder Bediako is GC Secretary and Elder Lemon is GC Treasurer.
Vialo Weis(Quote)
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Geraty wrote a short piece about the Michigan Conference etc. In the article he plainly rejects the Seventh-day Adventist Church’s position on creation. He says he affirms Scripture, but he obviously doesn’t endorse the church’s understanding of it. Below is an excerpt from his article.
http://www.spectrummagazine.org/blog/2010/05/27/there_more_la_sierra_story
Shane Hilde(Quote)
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Rich and Justin have explained true unity very well. Sam Pipim also has explained this in his books. The false “unity” promoted by Satan and some liberals will ultimately destroy the SDA Church. True unity under God’s Law and Truth is the only way to have a unified church.
Ron Stone M.D.(Quote)
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BTW, Lawrence Geraty, as President of LSU, helped create the problem we see today. [edit]
Ron Stone M.D.(Quote)
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