I don’t think I understand the point you are making …

Comment on Eugenie Scott’s Letter of Alarm – “Evolution Under Attack” by Charles.

I don’t think I understand the point you are making in response to my point, Bill.

I have long understood that proclaiming the three angels messages was the primary mission of the SDA church – just as proclaiming a coming flood was the primary mission of Noah. Our church has chosen to represent themselves by the symbol of those three flying angels. Those three messages could be fairly summed as:

1) Acknowledge and worship the true Creator (including His Creatorship) as sovereign of the universe. This message clearly refers to the Sabbath commandment, as well. (v.7)

2) Clear exposure of the false systems of worship (including false ideas about our origins). (v.8)

3) Fair warning to the world of the impending judgement by God related to following the false systems. (v. 9-11)

Your point is well taken about v.12 not being an actual part of the core of the MESSAGE. That seems obvious. I have understood it to identify the people proclaiming the message – they have two important identifiers: (1) KEEP the commandments of God (including the 4th) AND (2) Have the testimony of Jesus.(salvation from our transgressions).

The rebel against God has multiple ways of attacking the truth – including:

* Teaching that we are each “a child of the universe” and that “as the trees and the stars, we have a RIGHT to be here…” – a position (supported by the ideas of evolution and “new age”) that there is no supreme God of the universe Who created everything, etc.
(countered by the 1st angels message).

* Teaching that Jesus nullified His law by dying on the cross – a position that actually supports the original contentions of Satan against the government of God.
(countered by the identification of “the saints” v.12)

* Teaching that we can each earn our own salvation by our works (as in “pennance”) – according to the Roman church. (countered by “the faith of Jesus” – v. 12)

As I understand them, the three angels messages are God’s final messages to a world that will perish – similarly as it did at the flood. There is an ark of safety to be found in those messages. God will put an end to the rebellion when it has fully matured. When will it be? Can it be much longer?

Making NO predictions, may I ask hypothetically: What if we KNEW for sure that it would be in 2012? What if we knew exactly the day? Would we be desperately warning everyone we care about? Or still having this conversation?

This (SDA) movement is more than 150 years old now. None of the “pioneers” would have thought it would go on for this long. How much longer will the Groom tary? Will our children grow up and have full careers? Is there any way that we as a “people” can hasten the great event? Surely it is clear that we have delayed it?

Honestly, at least for me, the discussions (or arguments) about “evolution” are pretty much irrelevant. Much of the world buys into this deception and the arguments are not changing anyone’s mind. My original interest here was in addressing the question: “Is evolution being taught in a Seventh-Day Adventist school.” IF the answer is “yes” – then – well, let’s just say that is a very sad answer. SDA true belief position on the matter is very clear. I am not here to argue with the world as to how we came to be here. I KNOW that in my heart, and surely there are a million websites where I could go to debate it. I really have no interest in the debate of evolution(any of its multiple forms) vs. literal creation.

Anyway: If there is something that I do not seem to understand concerning the three angels messages, then I am listening. Actually, they seem pretty clear to me after more than five decades of listening to them. And I know that any idea that counters a literal 6-day creation week a very few thousand years ago, is contrary to the most fundamental beliefs of true SDA people. AND that was/is the point I make.

Charles Also Commented

Eugenie Scott’s Letter of Alarm – “Evolution Under Attack”
I hope I can share this here.

I have begun reading The Story of Redemption by EG White. I’d like to put a couple of paragraphs that I came across – words that so perfectly present a message that is OPPOSITE of the notions of evolutionary thought – including notions of “Theistic Evolution”.

P. 49
Adam was carried down through successive generations and saw the increase of crime, of guilt and defilemnent, because man would yield to his naturally strong inclinations to transgress the holy law of God. He was shown the curse of God resting more and more heavily upon the human race, upon the cattle, and upon the earth, because of man’s continued transgression. He was shown that iniquity and violence would steadily increase; yet amid all the tide of human misery and woe, there would ever be a few would remain unsullied amid the prevailing moral degeneracy. Adam was made to comprehend what sin is–the transgression of the law. He was shown that moral, mental and physical degeneracy would result to the race, from transgression, until the world would be filled with human misery of every type.”

“The days of man were shortened by his own course of sin in transgressing the righteous law of God. The race was finally so greatly depreciated that they appeared inferior and almost valueless. There were generally incompetent to appreciate the mystery of Calvary, the grand and elevated facts of the atonement, and the plan of salvation, becaue of the indulgence of the carnal mind. Yet, notwithstanding the weakness, and enfeebled mental, moral and physical powers of the human race, Christ, true to the purpose for which He left heaven, continues His interest in the feeble, depreciated, degenerate specimens of humanity, and invites them to hide their weakness and great deficiencies in Him. If they come unto Him, He will supply all their needs.”

These two paragraphs present clear teaching that is not simply different from the ideas of evolution but, in fact, the exact opposite. White here presents in clear language what is so very foundational to Adventist belief. Contrary teaching is abundant in the world, but within our faith it represents a bold attack on the foundations of our faith – even if it is under the guise of “science”.

Eugenie Scott’s Letter of Alarm – “Evolution Under Attack”
It appears that the text I placed here from this weeks SS lesson went away. Wonder why?

Eugenie Scott’s Letter of Alarm – “Evolution Under Attack”
Bill –

I think we are pretty much on the same page.

Kathy –

I agree with you as well. Nothing is more important today to us AS INDIVIDUALS than to have a personal relationship with our redeemer.

Bob –

I appreciate yours posts.

Ron –

Have no idea what you are talking about but being “tickled” (or at least happy) I guess, is a good thing.

Ya’ll have a good week.

Recent Comments by Charles

2013 Annual Council Votes to Change Wording of Adventist Fundamental Belief #6
No matter how the FBs are worded, there will be contention about it.

Anyone who has fully embraced this message realizes that the days to Jesus’ coming are few. Thus it behooves us to be about the work of proclaiming the unique ADVENTIST message to a world that is facing impending doom.

May I suggest the sermons of Jeremiah Davis. (can be found on Youtube)

LSU Removes Dr. Lee Grismer as Chairman of the Biology Department
@gene fortner: I don’t think anyone really knows what powers were being exercised on 9/11. Clearly the airliners were involved.

It was an event that changed the world in ways that top-down powers would yearn for.

No point in speculation… I think Veith probably was mistaken to do that deep dive and it seems that he has quietly backed away from it.

The thing we must focus on is to “Turn your eyes upon Jesus….” Clearly, we are in “the last days”.

LSU Removes Dr. Lee Grismer as Chairman of the Biology Department
@David Read: I find Veith’s “theorizing” regarding “conspiracies” to be spot on and on topic.

There is a great “conspiracy” – otherwise known as “The Great Controversy”. It is the ultimate reality of our rebellious little world today. AND it is the foundation of all of these other problems we deal with.


LSU Removes Dr. Lee Grismer as Chairman of the Biology Department
Evidence that God is in control. LSU could become a beacon of light shining on the truth of our world an how we came to be here. That is as it should be.

La Sierra University gets 3-year AAA Accreditation
I believe we are involved in a Mount Carmel experience. As this world is hurling toward the great climactic “END”, we will see more and greater attacks against the truth by the great deceiver. The prophets of Baal will become bolder and more feverish. (Remember that the prophets of Baal on Mt Carmel were much from within the nation of Israel.)

What a day of reckoning it will be when “at such a time as we think not” that great cloud approaches this world. The signs today are loud and bold. Jesus is coming. Spread the word.