Adventist Review examines LSU conflict

But this gives one pause for reflection. If the trees being killed are all pre-flood trees – then we should see a large group that are over 1600 years old at the time that they are uprooted. The fact that the 700 year number shows up layer after layer – implies that the catestrophic event happened after the world wide flood killed the pre-flood trees.
That means these are very likely post-flood 700 year old trees being wiped out by a sequence of catestrophic events. So it is likely a localized (North America only) event that happens 700 years after the flood.
in Christ,
Bob

This is correct. Speciment Ridge is made up of Tertiary sediments and is therefore a post-Flood formation.

Sean Pitman
www.DetectingDesign.com

Adventist Review examines LSU conflict

Nic Samojluk says:
April 3, 2010

Sean,

I greatly appreciate the time you have taken to answer point by point the objections presented by David Jacobson. Your answers make a lot of sense. They do build my trust in the historicity of Noah’s Flood story as recorded in the Bible.

As I read the comments which are posted above, I have been wondering. How come none of the LSU science and theology teachers step up to defend what the university has been doing on this issue.

How should we interpret this deafening silence on their part? I wish someone would organize a public debate over this issue with these science teachers having an opportunity to present a defense of what they are doing. It would be akin to what Elijah did with those who were opposed to the prophet’s strong held beliefs.

Hi Nic,

Very few, even among young-life creationists, want to get involved in a public debate on this issue because it would threaten those theistic evolutionists at LSU and at other schools and cause an even bigger ruckus within the SDA Church. This is why not too many want to be publicly associated with efforts like EducateTruth.com. They don’t want to be that politically incorrect in their associations…

Sean Pitman
www.DetectingDesign.com

Adventist Review examines LSU conflict

So, let anyone who is thinking of calling for a purge of the SDA educational system, first study the evidence carefully, and even try to take a look first hand. (Specimen Ridge is on public land.) I think you will come to appreciate that there can be good people, even devout people, who conclude that to be honest, they have to accept that the age of the earth must be greater than 6000 years.

— David Jacobson

Hi David,

I think your information on Specimen Ridge is just a bit outdated. What might seem obvious at first approximation, even after what seems to be careful investigation, often turns out later to be mistaken.

There are many problems with the in situ hypothesis, or the notion that the trees in the layers at Specimen Ridge actually grew there over generations of forests one on top of the other.

1. Many of the layers of “soil” are not at the base of the trees, but are often half-way up the trees.

2. The “soil” shows no sign of decay from top to bottom as would be expected in a normal forest setting. Also, the soil is water sorted, course to fine.

3. Tree-ring analysis of trees in different layers match – indicating that they grew at or near the same time.

4. Chemical analysis of the volcanic sedimentary material in the different levels indicates that this material was produced, in all of the levels, with in a 3-month period of time.

5. No remains of animal bones, skins, eggs, trackways, burrows, or other trace fossils have been identified in any of the layers.

6. The tops of the trees are cleanly cut off by the next layer, showing no evidence of decay or bioturbation and degeneration as would be expected if a new forest actually required extensive periods of time to produce the next higher layer.

7. The pine needs and leaves do not consistently match the trees which are associated with them. In other words, mats of leaves will be found associated with pine trees and mats of pine needs are found in association with deciduous trees.

8. While intact roots do remain, these largely consist of smaller roots. The larger roots, along with the branches and bark of these trees, have been broken off.

These features and others discussed on my website, are far more consistent with a sudden catastrophic formation of these layers and transport of the vertical trees within them…

For further information on this topic see:

http://www.detectingdesign.com/fossilrecord.html#Stacked_Forrests

I’ll give you one thing though… At least you’re not claiming to be something you’re not. You’re not taking money from an organization while directly undermining what that organization is paying you to do at the same time. This is admirable. LSU should follow your example and have those teachers who believe like you do to go and teach elsewhere for those of like mind who are more than willing to pay them for their views…

Sean Pitman
www.DetectingDesign.com

Conrad Vine Continues to Attack Church Leadership
I think that there can be a reasonable combination of the best of modern medicine as well as the best of healthful living and natural remedies such as exercise, sunlight, vitamin D, “forest bathing”, good sleep, vegan or at least a vegetarian diet, etc…

Conrad Vine Continues to Attack Church Leadership
You opted not to get vaccinated during the pandemic, for whatever reason, but did not advise others to do the same. That’s fine. I think you probably increased your own risk a bit, but that’s far better than giving medical advice to others when you don’t know for sure that you’re right – especially for those who were at higher risk than you. It’s also good that you supported others who did choose to get vaccinated.

As far as SDA hospitals and organizations, I agree that there has been some drift from the ideal. I’m not happy that so many non-SDAs are hired to work in and to be leaders. I’m also disappointed that there isn’t a lot more emphasis, direction, and teaching with regard to healthful living. There are some who are doing this, like Dr. Roger Seheult. However, there does seem to be a lack of an organized or official emphasis on how to living healthful so as to avoid having to use so many medications for chronic conditions that are largely self-inflicted. Now, I do sympathize that quick fixed and pills are what most patients want. Most doesn’t want to give up their back health habits, so doctors often just give up and give their patients what they want. Still, this does not excuse the lack of effort along these lines in our hospitals and medical schools. Also, more should be done to spread the Gospel Message in our hospitals as well…

Conrad Vine Continues to Attack Church Leadership
Thank you for your kind words and support. I really appreciate it very much!

Conrad Vine Continues to Attack Church Leadership
I’m fine with open dialogue, but that includes presenting and at least understanding things from the GC’s perspective and why the significant majority of SDAs and GC delegates believe that the GC did the right thing during the pandemic and with the original 2015 statement on vaccines.

Conrad Vine Continues to Attack Church Leadership
So, it’s impossible to be a doctor who promotes the best of modern medicine as well as the best natural remedies and still be a follower of Jesus? Really? Not even Ellen White could be saved then…