This survey is probably being put out by the General …

Comment on LSU surveys students by J Taylor.

This survey is probably being put out by the General Conference as La Sierra would not have wanted to obtain this data itself. LSU cannot pick and choose the data.

There have been a few developments that have not been discussed on this website. First of all, there is indication that LSU President Randal Wisbey and Pacific Union President Ricardo Graham have been called to answer at the General Conference. Neither was prepared for the tough questioning by the church administration. Ultimately, the rumor is that James Standish, who works in religious liberty and a lawyer was asked to mediate the dispute and manage what is happening.

Seeing that there will now be objective voices at the GC level, and much being generated by the exposure to this issue that brought about, it is anticipated that the GC will ultimately make LSU an “offer they can’t refuse.”

Another point of order is that WASC had requested that La Sierra release the WASC report but La Sierra has managed to bury it. Only a few copies are known to exist and the LSU administration has been trying to maintain control over that information. The question is whether WASC really did say that Educate Truth and other “outside influences” really had a negative effect on La Sierra.

All of this is more sensitive because LSU recently finished a beautiful biology complex. Some of the biology professors haven’t darkened the door of an Adventist Church for years.

There is likely to be a symposium in 2011 and La Sierra will ultimately have to answer not to the parents but to the General Conference which may pull denominational accreditation. Millions of dollars are at stake.

La Sierra’s abysmal efforts in public relations are a prime example of what not to do. Even if La Sierra ultimately loses out, the GC will shift its support to Loma Linda which has managed to be both a scientific leader and a denominational leader. It may lean liberal but it’s smart enough not to be as arrogant toward conservative students.

In the eyes of many at the GC, Shane Hilde and the others here are folk hero simply because of how La Sierra treated them. They have managed to beat the political machine at La Sierra and emerge stronger in the faith. LSU tried everything to smear the reputation of dissident students which really played to the advantage of the students.

La Sierra really has the next move here, and more likely than not they are going to take the left-wing tactic instead of making biology department replacements. There are two names that show up repeatedly including Lee Grismer and Gary Bradley. Bradley is too close to retirement to care but Grismer is leading some very important research having nothing to do with evolution. It is believed that Grismer was put out by the department as a sacrificial lamb by the biology and religion departments. Grismer is an asset and should be allowed to continue in his position but he did make some massive mistakes in dealing with dissident students.

Hopefully the GC will also take a serious look at the religion department which has green-lighted what has happened in the biology department by providing theological cover.

Graham will likely start to distance himself from Wisbey in the near term, and will likely be willing to recommend Wisbey’s resignation. Having said that, Wisbey may have opportunities at smaller liberal arts colleges and be able to bow out gracefully. Graham is pretty much bullet proof as he has avoided making concrete decisions in most areas of the church administration ever since he was in Northern California and had to deal with some problematic personnel issues with the Sacramento Central Church. He punted the ball and went with the popular side and that’s what he’s probably going to do here too.

Watch for Graham to be “promoted” to some obscure NAD department or to retire.

Recent Comments by J Taylor

Panda’s Thumb: ‘SDAs are split over evolution’
Belief in creation is a statement of faith. The main problem at LSU is not that they taught about evolution but that they have systematically through their religion and science departments torn away at the fundamental beliefs of the church by minimizing Creationism.

What we see here from Ervin Taylor, Professor Kent and a few others is essentially the same approach that has been used by professors in the Biology and Religion departments. They mock traditional Adventism and make it genuinely difficult for students who wish to hold to the beliefs of the church based on faith rather than secular science.

Panda’s Thumb: ‘SDAs are split over evolution’
The Seventh-day Adventist Church has long believed in a literal creation week as a fundamental belief. Ellen White discussed this extensively. It is supported throughout the Bible. While there is certainly room for freedom of belief in this arena, the church also has the freedom to make sure that those in its employ do not undermine this belief.

Why those who would seek to do so continue to insist on working within the Adventist Church is a mystery. Even if the belief is not supported, etc., it is the belief of the church. So why not go teach somewhere else?

There is a strange habit of those who lose their interest in the beliefs of the Adventist Church to hang around as detractors. Whereas in other churches, those who no longer practice the belief find more amicable climes.

If you do not like the teachings of the church, and the church remains unyielding to your protestations, then your alternative is to leave the church.

Panda’s Thumb: ‘SDAs are split over evolution’
I would like to hear a statement of faith in the second coming from one Adventist evolutionist.

So far it seems that they are cultural Christians who are actually agnostic or atheistic.

I get what Pitman is saying, and it’s not “Pitman’s Way or the Highway.” It’s what God has revealed through the Bible that Pitman supports. Do you believe that God can create something out of nothing and will do so in the future? Do you believe that God did create with the power of His Word?

If not, I respect your right to believe as you do, but do not see significant value to your theological positions.

Panda’s Thumb: ‘SDAs are split over evolution’
The following is from the book Christian Education. It is long so I’ve shortened it a bit but you can find the entire article at

I’ve posted this not for the purpose of trying to convince skeptics of literal creation for they will never be convinced unless the Holy Spirit works upon their hearts, but rather for the purpose of encouraging those who are on the narrow path to remain true to their faith and to their God.


God has permitted a flood of light to be poured upon the world, in both science and art; but when professedly scientific men treat upon these subjects from a merely human point of view, they will assuredly come to wrong conclusions. It may be innocent to speculate beyond what God’s word has revealed, if our theories do not contradict facts found in the Scriptures; but those who leave the word of God, and seek to account for his created works upon scientific principles, are drifting, without chart or compass, upon an unknown ocean. The greatest minds, if not guided by the word of God in their research, become bewildered in their attempts to trace the relations of science and revelation. Because the Creator and his works are so far beyond their comprehension that they are unable to explain them by natural laws, they regard Bible history as unreliable. Those who doubt the reliability of the records of the Old and New Testaments, will be led to go a step farther, and doubt the existence of God; and then, having lost their anchor, they are left to beat about upon the rocks of infidelity. {CE 193.2}

These persons have lost the simplicity of faith. There should be a settled belief in the divine authority of God’s holy word. The Bible is not to be tested by men’s ideas of science. Human knowledge is an unreliable guide. Skeptics who read the Bible for the sake of caviling, may, through an imperfect comprehension of either science or revelation, claim to find contradictions between them; but rightly understood, they are in perfect harmony. Moses wrote under the guidance of the Spirit of God; and a correct theory of geology will never claim discoveries that cannot be reconciled with his statements. All truth, whether in nature or in revelation, is consistent with itself in all its manifestations. {CE 193.3}

[edited for length of quotes]

Panda’s Thumb: ‘SDAs are split over evolution’
“We are in the business of saving sinners, not proving creation!”

Professor Kent – The entire plan of salvation revolves around the concept of a paradise lost, with God redeeming His Creation. If He is not all powerful, then how does God have the power to save?

I fear that at the root of this Creation question is the question of who God in fact is. Does God have the power to save? Does God have the power to create a New Earth? Is Jesus coming again? Is the resurrection really possible? (Try proving resurrection from scientific literature – it’s not possible!)

I have yet to hear an Adventist evolutionist proclaim the mighty power of God, practice evangelism, or talk with conviction about the miracles of God. I have yet to hear them speak of the soon coming of Christ. Instead they speak in vague generalities about being “good people” who are “godly” but speak with very little conviction of any Biblical truths.

Those who promote evolution in our schools may be “good people” but they have little regard for assertions of Biblical truth. They cringe at the phrase, “Thus saith the Lord.” They call themselves “emergent” and want to be “relevant” but God has not called us to relevance – He called us to preach the Gospel.

We are a church that is based on the Three Angels Messages, and those who insist that our institutions preach contrary to these messages are ultimately going to be on the wrong side of history. They will either have to be shaken out or leave of their own accord.

Revelation 14:7 – Angel 1
“Fear God and give him glory, because the hour of his judgment has come. Worship him who made the heavens, the earth, the sea and the springs of water.”

Angel 2 –
“Fallen! Fallen is Babylon the Great, which made all the nations drink the maddening wine of her adulteries.”

Angel 3 – If anyone worships the beast and his image and receives his mark on the forehead or on the hand, 10he, too, will drink of the wine of God’s fury, which has been poured full strength into the cup of his wrath. He will be tormented with burning sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and of the Lamb. 11And the smoke of their torment rises for ever and ever. There is no rest day or night for those who worship the beast and his image, or for anyone who receives the mark of his name.” 12This calls for patient endurance on the part of the saints who obey God’s commandments and remain faithful to Jesus.”

It’s not “relevant” to most of the world, but it’s the truth.

Stand firm!!!!! Don’t give up the fight!!!!!